early proofs ( 20th century ) sleepers?

I just recently picked up a 1940 merc. Proof and a 1942 walking liberty proof..

All I have to say is WOW!
These things are amazing! The strikes, the “luster”

I am kind of amazed that these coins are not worth a whole lot more, take the 1940 proof dime. Only 11,000 of these where minted, but they can be purchased for around $100.00

A sleeper? I think so. The entire early 20th century proof coins seem like sleepers to me…

Any one else here have a collection of early proofs? Thoughts on the subject?

 

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There's been a lot of talk on this topic in recent months, especially here.

I've written a couple of Coin World articles specifically on early proofs dated 1859-1916. It's an understatement to say these coins are largely underappreciated (therefore, potentially undervalued) today, especially for the smaller denominations up to the dime.

If you have any specific questions fire away.

 

I agree that most older proof proof coins are sleepers...I just got a PF66 NGC 1954 Franklin for under $100...
I'm going to try to get more of these older proof coins!

Speedy

 

some of the mintage numbers are insane!
I mean, think about it. 800,000 1916-D mercury dimes where made, lets say a quarter of them survived, thats 200,000 people that can own a 1916-D mercury dime.

the 1942 mercury dime proof had a mintage of around 11,000.... lets pretend that ALL of them have survived...

thats only 11,000 people on the planet that can own one of these coins... and the price diference! a 1916-D in good is around $800.00 right?
a proof 1942 dime can be had for around the $150.00 mark!

heres to speculating! cheers!

 

If the hobby was logical, this sort of situation wouldn't exist. I think there is a lot to be said for collecting what is (1) scarce, (2) in a high state of preservation, and (3) relatively inexpensive. But I always tell people I'm 2/3 investor and 1/3 collector, so this approach might or might not work. It depends on tastes changing in the collecting world over long periods of time. Theoretically, every dog [and coin] should have it's day. Practically speaking, it doesn't always work that way.

 

As I noted in my above post, early proofs, those prior to 1917, have much more remarkably low mintage figures. When you get into the 19th century proofs, especially the 60's and 70's, many have only a 50% or so survival rate (some lower, some higher). The highest mintage until the mid-70's is 1000. The highest mintage other than that was in 1883 and was about 6600. Big whoop, but it makes current modern day (including 1940's) mintage figures look sky high!

 

I saw a seated liberty dime graded proof 63 at my local coin shop today.... It was buisy so i didn;t ask the price, but i am sure it's out of my price range


When i finally become a "Well heeled" collector i will probably buy early proofs, as they say "rare is rare"!!!

 

Actually, if a Proof 63 S.L. Dime is probably pretty attractively valued. You should ask. If the coin looks attractive and has decent eye appeal (which might be a stretch for a 63) you might want to jump on it, but you have to like it. Let us know how much he wants for it and what you think of the coin.

 

what she wants

I will ask her next time i am in the shop, but my budget right now is <$100.00
;(

 

ok, its a half dime 1873 PR62 graded by PCI
Price tag is $200.00

I asked her to set it aside for me, and i was thinking about getting it on monday. mintage is 600!!!!

The coin looks really good to me, but not very "proof" like, but i am not as familiar with the old proofs...

any advice? It seems like a really good deal...

 

Be VERY careful. Truth be told, PR62 coins usually suck. Technically speaking, anything under 65 means it has problems. Although, I have plenty of PR64 coins and even a PCI PR63. Unless PCI was ultra-conservative on the coin and the coin has really nice eye appeal, which I'm not sure how it could for a 62, I'd pass even for only $200; especially if it lacks any real proof qualities such as at least medium mirrors. I agree that an 1873 Proof Half Dime is cool to have; I have one in PR64 and it's toned a complete even cobalt/gun-metal blue on both sides (unattractive to some, dynamite to others). That said, $200 is quite cheap for a coin with only 600 minted and probably less than 400 survive (conservatively, but it might even be less than 300). It's up to you, if you like it and nothing seriously detracts the eye, then maybe it's good to get. Any chance the dealer can do a couple of close-up digital photos for you so you can post 'em? Maybe you can bargain her down a bit. But, I would almost count on a 100% chance in the future when you're in a better financial position you'll be looking to upgrade the coin.

Bruce

 

it did not have any real mirrors, If i purchased it i would want to send it to NGC or PCGS...

How rare is it to find these coins on the market? with only 600 of them ( at the very best ) even existing it would seem like it would be rare to come accross them...

I just don;t want to let this one go just to kick myself later

I am starting to get attracted to the early proofs, especially since i made my recent merc/walker proof finds...

damn! its like foreign gold... once you get one you want another...

 

Ranchhand, a proof Mercury dime is a thing of beauty. I am amazed at how beautiful they are. A Walking Liberty Half Dollar is also beautiful. Those were beautiful coins just in business strike, but put them in proof and WOW!!!

Are the 19th century proofs as mirrored or bright as the 20th century proofs were in 1936 to 1942. I am sure they are not like the modern proofs, but a proof Trade Dollar might be a real sight or are they hard to discern the proof striking?? Hope that question makes sense.

 

How can that be?....it seems that a weakly struck coin could take it down a grade...and being as old as they are it seems that even if they are under PF65 they would still be ok.

The reason I ask is because I have been looking for some older proof coins but I don't think I would be able to put some of the $$$ to get them over PF65....maybe PF62/63.

Ranchhand....I would pass just because its slabbed by PCI...it might be over graded by 1 grade.

Speedy

 

I agree that PCI tends to be 1 grade-point optimistic in many cases, however I wouldn't pass it up just because it's in a PCI slab. Technically speaking, any grader will tell you, usually a coin will get less than a 65 due to some noticeable hairlines (generally hairlines on a 65 either much less visible to far fewer in number...like 1) or some other problem, like a minor carbon spot or two. A 65 grade is indicative of the "typical" coin as it left the mint presses and to the collector. Anything less usually means something that happened to the coin after it was minted.

63 indicates a fairly strongly hairlined coin and many times too distracting for many collectors.

62 indicates some severe hairlines and or "hits" on the coin.

60-61 indicates more hits and "bruises" and severe hairlines on the coin.

Collectors typically like to stay above 63 but sometimes a 63 will work. The investor mind-set person aims at 65 or above, which I don't think is always an intelligent "investor" move. But, hey, I've been proven wrong before!

 

That will be ok for me...I don't buy coins if I see carbon...its almost like damage to me.

Thanks for the info...as a collector and not a investor I don't go for the highest grade...just the best that I can.

Thanks again

Speedy

 

If i remember corrctly the reverse had some dark spots on it, the front was grayish but looked ok.

I probably should purchase a book on early proof coinage before purchasing any more of them

Are their any things i should look for? are black toning spots a bad thing ( bad enough to kill the sale )

any recomendations on books?

 

Was it toning spots...or carbon?

When I see a coin with carbon it kills the deal for me...it seems that once there is carbon...even just a few spots...its gets more and more spots till you have a coin no one wants to buy.

Speedy

 

There's only one book that's even remotely helpful with early proofs and that's Breen's book on the Encyclopedia of Colonial and U.S. Proofs, 1722-1977 (or 1989...same books essentially except for several errata pages). They're out of print but obtainable on eBay.

Rick Tomaska is apparently working on a new Early Proof book and it will take a year or so before it's out.

If you can get a hold of the Feb 7-21 editions of Coin World, I did a 3 part series on Early Proofs to get you acquainted. Also, the July edition of the newstand (only!) verion of Coin Values had an article I wrote on Early Proofs that incorporated some of the Coin World stuff plus some embellishments on the proofing process, toning, and grading.

 

The more I read these posts, the more interested I become in obtaining 1942 proof coins, which seem affordable.

I was born in 1942, and have quite a few circulation '42 coins. But a proof or two of my birth year would be great. Guess I'll look into it!