Black dealers/coin collectors

I have ask this question on other sites and have not been answered in the manner expected. A quick answer and then a quicker brush-off.

If any thing in this hobby is to be considered "rare" it would have to be a black coin collector and/or dealer. As far as I have been able to determin, there is one in N.J. and he has as his buyers, such people as Carl Malone and Bill Cosby. So from this I know there is 1 dealer and 2 collectors. That is it!
Been to many shows and have never seen any blacks in attendance or showing. Don't have any idea if there are any in ANA or not. There board of goverenors and officers are very, very "white". Oh yea they have to females running for office this time. Where are all the women collectors?

Any ideas why there isn't some black in this hobby? They sure have some greaat coins to collect if they were interested. See below;
http://www.joelscoins.com/africa.htm

 

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Integration is anti-differentiation

I don't know, either, and I have asked myself the same question many times. "It just is." Once the tradition was established the momentum continiued. Why are there Black opera singers, astronauts, doctors, accountants and everything else, apparently 11% of the total of any random group, but not so in numismatics? I don't know. But it is curious.

When I started in the hobby, I interviewed a couple who owned a coin store, and Mrs. Matthews gave me a great quote about the hobby of numismatics being "a level playing field where knowledge is king."

I never knew a coin dealer to discriminate on any irrelevant standards such as gender or race or religion.

This is a hobby where we buy and sell money: it is the essence of capitalism. Ernst Samhaber said in Merchants Make History that a good merchant never argues religion with a client. He was speaking of the Portuguese and Dutch in Asia, but it applies widely, and especially in numismatics. I have seen just about every travesty of commerce on the bourse floor -- fakes, over-graded, whizzed, even pretending to look in Greysheet and then giving a different price -- but I have never seen discrimination on the basis of gender (or preference), race, or religion, or national origin, or disability, or anything else.

You could blame historical factors. Blacks have had less disposable income over time. However, that gap has been closing for a generation.

How about other groups? Asians, Hispanics? Newfies? I am always surprised to find political liberals. Once, at a coin show, I met an actual fascist, collecting the coins of World War II Italy.

 

I think, in a lot of cases it's one of those things that take time... maybe measured in generations. You can't go back that far in history when there would have been serious barriers into the hobby, as a reflection of society as a whole. You give it a couple more generations, though, things will change.

 

OldDan, how does one determine who is "black"?

If one bases the determination on the pigmentation of skin coloration, there are varying degrees. Human beings exist in every color from stark white to indigo black. There are immeasurable shades in between, so how could one determine where to draw the line?

If one bases the determination on heritage, e.g. those persons whose ancestors originated in Africa, then every human being on the planet is included. The scientific concensus is that the hominid genus originated in Africa. Since I live in the United States, I could refer to myself as African-American (regardless of the pigmentation of my skin). Though, I rather refer to myself as "American" or simply "Scott".

If one bases the determination on facial features (or other physical characteristics), well, that would open a can of worms. Everyone is unique.

To tell you the truth, I've never taken notice at a coin show or coin shop of a lesser ratio of darkly pigmented persons compared to lightly pigmented persons. When I'm at either venue, there are only two colors that I'm interested in: Silver and Gold.

 

EDITED---for as not to offend anyone on this forum

I have seen 1 black guy at my dealer. Really nice guy to; not that there is anything wrong with that......

 

Mitchell,

I can't believe how insensitive your post is.

 

This is an interesting subject for sure. I think part of the reason is the historically lower disposable income thing, since many collectors get started by inheriting or being given coins from grandparents, etc. But, as has been said, this sort of reason should be far less relevant in the last generation or so.

Maybe blacks see it as a “white hobby” and do not participate. But, I don’t see anything about it that should drive anyone away. Coin collectors are not colorblind when it comes to gold and silver, etc., but otherwise I do not think race plays any part.

 

Hey CoinOKC,

It is obvious that this is a very sensitive subject for you, understandable by most anyone with a brain. However, the genera you reference as Homo Sapient (Mankind) and their origin is based off of ScientificTheroy, Carbon Dating and Genetic structure discovered in other species that go far beyond what has been mentioned here. To my knowledge, the origin of man has never been established to originate in Africa. I think old Dan is making a general reference to a Race of People known as African Americans. While not quite PC, and belive me just plain outright slang, we Americans of all races have grown to be lazy and use improper verbage to discribe most anything these days. I do not feel that Old Dan was trying to be insultive, just using a polite general term for that particular race of people. After all what is caucasian? Who gave a race that name? It is defined as; of or relating to European, no African or South West Asian ancestry. Man, thats a lot of people. The thing we should all focus on is how can we provide information and knowledge to all races about our hobby? After all there are several coins relating to Black Leaders, Educators and Political figures. Be proud and promote our histroy through coins, just as you live your everyday life. Black, White, Asian, or whatever..you after all, "you said that all you see is Silver and Gold"...lighten up a little.

RickieB

 

U forgot 2 mention, they hate the word "Negro" and prefer 2 b called "black".

 

To all on this thread - How do you know that I'm not black?

 

I agree that this is an interesting thread - lets get back on the topic, though. This question was specifically designed toward numismatics.

It's good that some responses have been in the general nature that 'I look past that', but if you look back on your experiences, I think you will find that OldDan has a point. The question then becomes, 'why?'. Is the hobby not geared toward attracting everyone?

I still think it has to do with a generational issue. I was hooked on collecting by my father - in some cases, people say their father was hooked on collecting by his father.

It also stands to say that I see vastly more men in this hobby than women.

 

In your photo, your nose looks awfully black, but I can't see the rest under all that hair.

 

I started a thread touching on this topic some months ago. I think it's primarily a generational thing, too, with its distant origins in class economics. If that's the case, and with more racial economic equality in recent years, I think it's likely that in the coming decades the hobby will make headway in other ethnic groups.

 

Good one!

 

Hi, Rickie!

I'm referencing the scientific data to which I'm familiar. Specifically, the discovery of "Lucy" in Hadar, Ethiopia which is the oldest known ancestor of the hominid genus.

Regardless, whether or not a person agrees that our human ancestors originated in Africa, we DO share a common ancestor from somewhere back in time and from someplace on earth.

My point is this (cliche'd as it may sound): We all belong to the human race... period. I would be glad to see a day when differentiation based on the pigmentation of a person's skin is no longer a factor of discussion.

However, the human species likes to categorize. We are inherently suspicious and fearful of anything that is different from ourselves.

As far as "blacks" attending a coin show and suggesting that "they" might enjoy articles relating to "coins from Africa" segments a group of people who obviously enjoy the same hobby as anyone else.

I fail to see why anyone who is "black" would enjoy the coins from Africa more than anyone else. Comments like this smart of racisim (sorry, folks, I call it the way I see it). Don't let racism die a slow death - kill it quickly.

 

Hey CoinOKC...

You forgot to mention in the quote that I said "To my knowledge" I watched the PBS broadcast on "Lucy" as well and it is indeed fascinating. Do not misunderstand what I am saying, racial overtones of any sort are best not spoken, however, you will always find comment about it in one form or another. Do not let this get your blood pressure up! Each of us grew up in a different environment, State, with different parents whom passed along personal preferences to their now grown children..I am one of them. The changes made are the ones you make yourself. As long as there are people on the face of the Earth, there will be conflict. My finding is that since I have been on this fourm I have read tons of stuff about world coins and while I appreciate the artristy and beauty of those coins I do not find an interest in them for the most part. I am an American who collects American coins of all kinds but very partial to the AGE series as well as the ASE series which I have massed together allof those except the elusive 1995W ASE...I have over 1/2 of the AGE series in collection as we speak..but you will not find a single World Coin in them all.
There are folks of many races here who have preferences in collecting...lets keep our focus on what we enjoy, not what ticks us off! Does no one any good to get MAD...feel free to email me anytime...sounds like you have a Biology or Chemical Engineering background..I work in Bio Pharmaceuticals as a Cell Culture Scientist...how about you?

 

Well, there's no way around it - it's a touchy subject for all the periferal reasons that our culture has instilled in us. So some responses are bound to come across that way.

But isn't it important to analyze the truth behind the question? As was brought up in a popular thread not to long ago - there is room for everyone in this hobby, but in application, is enough being done to introduce the hobby to everyone?

It may be a simple answer relating to demographics of numismatic interests.

 

This thread sounds like Sociology-Anthropology 101 at some far-left liberal college. What group is going to come up next for discussion? Athletes, hippies, actors, cowboys or what? Take your pick. Hate to see everyone getting bored with coins and need some diversion to play on the computers!!!