Does withdrawn always mean fake?

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by DiomedesofArgos, Dec 22, 2020.

  1. DiomedesofArgos

    DiomedesofArgos Well-Known Member

    It's not rare to look through an auction and see withdrawn lots. Should I interpret this as the coins were determined to be fakes? Or are there other reasons that are common for withdrawing lots?
     
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  3. SensibleSal66

    SensibleSal66 U.S Casual Collector / Error Collector

    From someone who thinks "outside of the box": There may be a number of reasons I would think . Sellers remorse, wrong coin, found an Error , Fake , etcc...
     
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  4. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    There's countless reasons an auction house could withdrawal something. Sometimes you will see it appear back at a later auction. While being fake is one of the many reasons it could happen, I wouldn't automatically assume that. Often times it can just be something related to the terms of the consignment for a bigger consignment
     
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  5. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    Could be one of the following.

    Coin did not meet the reserve.
    Questionable ownership.
    Error in the listing.
    Coin went missing.
    Coin sold before the auction.
    No bidders and the coin sold to the book.
    The seller ticked off the auction house.
    The images were really bad and the coin was pulled.
    Coin was found to be a rare variety not shown in the listing.
     
  6. Pellinore

    Pellinore Well-Known Member

    Or consignor judged the limit was set too low by the auction house.
     
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  7. gsimonel

    gsimonel Well-Known Member

    All of the above reasons are possible, but I think being identified as a fake is the most common.
     
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  8. Paul M.

    Paul M. Well-Known Member

    Sure, any of the reasons others have mentioned could be the case. It could also be that there's a question about the coin's authenticity, but it later reappears after being found genuine.
     
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  9. Bob Evancho

    Bob Evancho Well-Known Member

    Could the coin have been a national treasure removed from the country illegally? Could the coin have been a stolen item and removed from the sale? What other reasons could a coin be pulled from a sale that is not listed here on Coin Talk? This is an interesting subject and a learning experience.
     
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  10. otlichnik

    otlichnik Well-Known Member

    With high end antiquities auctions it can mean that a foreign state has staked a claim or started legal proceedings. Though we have also seen some cases recently where the auction house completely ignored the request and proceed with the sale anyway.

    SC
     
  11. scottishmoney

    scottishmoney Buh bye

    Also could have been misatributed. I have seen a few of those in CNG auctions that then got pulled.
     
  12. Paul M.

    Paul M. Well-Known Member

    Do you have any links to actual cases? I’m curious how something like that ends up resolving. If a coin is legally the n private hands in another country, and that country attempts to intervene in the sale, but the auction house sells it anyway, what happens to the buyer, the seller, the auction house, and all the money that changes hands?
     
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  13. Ed Snible

    Ed Snible Well-Known Member

    The ACCG case was coins in private hands in the UK, but minted in Cyprus, which the ACCG tried to import into the United States. Because of the MOU the government of Cyprus got the coins back, without evening having to intervene.

    https://culturalpropertynews.org/us-customs-delivers-7-national-treasure-coins-worth-200to-cyprus/

    US Customs will seize coins. Sometimes there isn't even a case, such as these coins shipped from a Munich coin dealer to a California collector:

    https://www.ice.gov/news/releases/i...eturned-looted-greek-artifacts-rightful-owner

    It is unclear what the seller's legal and moral obligation is. It may depend on if the seller declared the coins in accordance with Customs law.
     
  14. Ocatarinetabellatchitchix

    Ocatarinetabellatchitchix Well-Known Member

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  15. otlichnik

    otlichnik Well-Known Member

    Most that I remember involved larger antiquities, not coins.

    In June there was the case of the Nigerian statues auctioned by Christie's. In that case the auction went ahead.

    SC
     
  16. Andrew McCabe

    Andrew McCabe Well-Known Member

    As a seller, I've asked for my coins to be pulled from auctions because of
    - bad images
    - auction placement up didn't match what I was offered e.g. offered a dedicated section but my coins actually mixed with large numbers of apparently recent hoard coins (I'm a provenance freak).

    So "auction house ticked off the seller" can be added to the list. I also know several instances of "coin sold before auction". So there are indeed multiple reasons and context might or might not tell you which.
     
  17. john65999

    john65999 Well-Known Member

    SOMETIMES, LIKE ME... i sell the same item (or rather offer) so ebay, facebook, flea market etc.. so sometimes i sell an item elsewhere then have to remove the listing, pretty simple me thinks
     
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