Bust half slightly overgraded?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by jloring, Jan 24, 2009.

  1. jloring

    jloring Senior Citizen

    I picked this bust half up today from my local coin shop. It was graded (by the owner) VF-20. I believe there's too much wear to justify this grade, especially on the reverse. I was able to get him to lower the price somewhat, so I added it to my collection. Any opinions?
     

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  3. johnny54321

    johnny54321 aspiring numismatist

    It's close IMO; but I'd go F-15
     
  4. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    The TPG's would call that VF20 all day long. However, unless I miss my guess that coin has been tooled. I'd take it back.
     
  5. rlm's cents

    rlm's cents Numismatist

    Do us all a favor and show us what you are talking about.
     
  6. jloring

    jloring Senior Citizen

    Thanks GD.... I'm not that familiar with tooling... I assume it means the borders of the image have been messed with to provide a higher relief. Looking at the coin under a 10x seems to confirm this. I'll take it back.
     
  7. bqcoins

    bqcoins Olympic Figure Skating Scoring System Expert

    Looks VF-20, reverse is actually pretty strong.I dunno about no toolin'. Where exactly at GD? Here is a VF-30 specimen that I have.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  8. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Well I think some of the lines in the hair curls are suspect, but I'd bet a lot that the clasp on that coin has been tooled.


    NOTE - that does it. The contest is officially over with this post.
     

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  9. Cloudsweeper99

    Cloudsweeper99 Treasure Hunter

    To me it looks like a nice VF. I don't have the expertise to tell whether or not it has been tampered with.
     
  10. jloring

    jloring Senior Citizen

    No doubt about it. I appreciate the help, and I've learned to look much closer at these older coins before I purchase them.
     
  11. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    You have the coin in hand, are you saying that you agree that the clasp has been tooled (recarved) ?
     
  12. jloring

    jloring Senior Citizen

    Absolutely.... someone engraved a perfect ellipse around the perimeter of the worn down clasp. I compared this coin to other bust halves I have of comparable grade, and there is no doubt. I also believe the curls have been tooled, along with at least a portion of the border of the image (especially the cap). I doubt that Ken (the owner of the shop) knowingly sold me a tooled coin; I assumed he overlooked this (as I did). I appreciate your input GD.... thanks!
     
  13. coleguy

    coleguy Coin Collector

    VF looks like a good grade for it.
    Guy~
     
  14. jloring

    jloring Senior Citizen

    Can a coin be tooled and still carry a grade? Does it even have value? I paid $60 for this coin, but I would like to return it. It definitely has been messed with.
     
  15. Thailand

    Thailand New Member

    I agree it is a VF-20.
     
  16. 900fine

    900fine doggone it people like me

    I gotta admit I missed it. I thought it was a decent coin, but I'm sure Doug is right. It's tooled.

    I looked at dozens of certified VF20s online, and none of them had anything remotely resembling that much clasp. All they had was a trace of detail or nothing at all.

    The hair is tooled as well.
     
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