1788 Rare Coin

Discussion in 'Coin Chat' started by Collecting Nut, Oct 12, 2020.

  1. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    No, this was struck by the State of Connecticut after we won our independence under the Articles of Confederation. They used a bust that is SIMILAR to that used on the British Halfpence because the similar design would make the coins more acceptable to the public. It does NOT indicate Georgius III Rex.
     
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  3. SensibleSal66

    SensibleSal66 U.S Casual Collector / Error Collector

    Then who is it . I always thought it was him .I'm not a very good Native of Connecticut I guess .
     
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  4. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

    This is what I read about the dirty money...

    Introduction
    A shortage of money was a problem for the American colonies. England did not supply its colonies with sufficient coinage and prohibited them from making their own. The early settlers brought coins from Europe but they went quickly back there to pay for supplies. Without enough money, the colonists had to barter for goods or use primitive currency such as Indian wampum, nails, and tobacco.

    edited - copyright
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 15, 2020
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  5. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

    The figure looks more Roman than Victorian to me. I don't know. I'm not very good at history at all.
     
  6. SensibleSal66

    SensibleSal66 U.S Casual Collector / Error Collector

    Hey Joe, check this out :
    STRUCK DURING THE REIGN OF AN AMERICAN KING – The copper half-penny coin was struck from 1727-1760 during the reign of England’s George II – America’s next-to last King! It bears a portrait of George II on the obverse and an image of a Seated Britannia on the reverse.
     
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  7. SensibleSal66

    SensibleSal66 U.S Casual Collector / Error Collector

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  8. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    It isn't anyone, just a bust similar in appearance to coins already familiar to the people. It isn't meant to actually be any particular person.
     
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  9. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

  10. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

    Because it's basically a counterfeit, but they had to do something so they gave people a familiar KG III coinage. ?? Kind of, I think.
     
  11. Kentucky

    Kentucky Supporter! Supporter

  12. Publius2

    Publius2 Well-Known Member

    Someone will have to explain to me what this term "dirty money" is supposed to mean. Because other than outright contemporary counterfeits, there was nothing illegitimate about the state coinage issued during the period of the Articles of Confederation.


    I think the familiarity concept has some merit as the Connecticut coppers do indeed have a design likeness to British coinage and it was always a challenge to introduce coinage and have it accepted by merchants and the public. But...

    The Connecticut Coppers of 1785 to 1788 are most definitely not counterfeit. They were struck by a private mint owed by Samuel Bishop, James Hillshouse, Joseph Hopkins, and John Goodrich in accordance with a granted right of the General Assembly of Connecticut on October 20, 1785. The authorization was for no more than L10,000 of lawful money in the form of halfpence of six penneyweight (144 grams) and to bear a design of a man's head on one side.

    The act also said "Nothing in this act shall be construed to make such coppers a legal tender in payment of any debt, except for the purpose of making even change, for any sum not exceeding three shillings."

    The Assembly four days later passed another act: "No person shall coin or manufacture any copper coin of any description or size without permission...from the General Assembly..."

    So, these Connecticut coppers were legal and struck under the authority of the General Assembly of Connecticut. Remember that the US won its independence in 1781 with Treaty of Paris signed in 1783. The former colonies, now neither colonies nor states, were more or less united under the Articles of Confederation until the Constitution was adopted, starting in 1787. The new United States did not pass a law creating a mint and coinage until 1792 and did not adopt decimal coinage until then.

    There are many different incarnations of the "man's head" on the Connecticut Coppers such as the Roman Head, African Head, Round Head, Double Chin, Broad Shouldered, Ornate Mailed, Scholar's Head, Small Head, Mutton Head, Horned Bust, etc. But none of them have been claimed to be a representation of George III.

    So, what is "dirty money"?
     
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  13. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

    The Coinage Act of 1792
    In 1787, the Constitution gave Congress exclusive power to coin money, and in 1792, Congress passed its first coinage act, establishing a national mint in Philadelphia.

    I just made up "dirty money".

    The coin in reference is 1778. So how did it fall under legitimate coin money if Congress did not pass the coinage act until 1792?
     
  14. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

    [QUOTE="Publius2,

    So, what is "dirty money"?[/QUOTE]

    It's certainly a way to get your attention, for sure. Thank you.
     
  15. Kentucky

    Kentucky Supporter! Supporter

    It's certainly a way to get your attention, for sure. Thank you.[/QUOTE]
    you really are bored...
     
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  16. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

    Holy quote mess
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  17. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

    It wasn't intentional??? But it did. With good reason I guess because there is apparently something I'm missing. And I appreciate his input.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  18. johnmilton

    johnmilton Well-Known Member

    Back in the 1780s, after we won our independence, it seemed like you could circulate most any copper so long as it was round, brown and had a head on the obverse and a seated figure on the reverse. Here are few coins and counterfeits from the era.

    A Vermont copper by Machin's Mills. Machin's Mills made real coins and counterfeits. The reverse on this one looks worn because it was also used to make a counterfeit British half penny. Making it look worn was thought to convince people to accpet it.

    1787 Vermont O.jpg 1787 Vermont R.jpg

    A Machin's Mills counterfeit.

    Machin Mills O.jpg Machin Mills R.jpg

    A genuine British half penny.

    1753 British half penny O.jpg 1753 British half penny R.jpg

    A Connecticut copper

    CT Copper O.jpg CT Copper R.jpg
     
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  19. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

    And here is a perfect example of the colonial coin conundrum.
     
  20. bruthajoe

    bruthajoe Still Recovering

    Sorry about the quote mess.
     
  21. l.cutler

    l.cutler Member

    Ah, this is what makes them interesting. I find modern coinage so boring with exact known mintages, who designed and minted them, precise grading scales. I'll take a little mystery and unknown, research and study any day!
     
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