Getting a coin conserved and graded with NGC -Newbie question.

Hello

I'm after some guidance.

I've got a victoria dei gratia coin 1855, I don't think its worth a fortune but it's a coin I like a lot + its already passed through two previous generations so I want to keep it safe and protected.

I understand theres NGC which can conserve and grade coins. Before I do this I want to seek a little advice on the best way to proceed.

In the picture the coin has some minor corrosion on it (next to the right arm and a little around the sides of the coin). I dont want todo anything to the coin myself but I'd hate for this to get worse...

If I send this off to NGC would they be able to work on this and improve this potentially? I'm not looking at selling, I just want to better protect the second oldest coins I have + its likely I would also do this to the oldest coin I have too.
The coin in the picture looks quite roughed up, it really doesn't look that bad in person...

Is it relatively simple and straight forward to get coins conserved - graded and put in protective slabs? I've never done this before so I'm worried somthing will go wrong, the coin will get damaged, lost etc.


Thank you

 

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My opinion, they aren't going to do it. They can remove the green they can remove the dark toning. They can't do anything about corrosion at all and that's going to get it a details grade right there no matter what you have done to it, it's not going to straight grade and is a "problem coin"

Just one person's opinion on it. I think they would refuse to do it because it will just make it even more apparent that it's been worked on. Normally they will only do conservation if it makes an improvement, like dark toning that hasn't corroded the coin yet but could if left there.

Then again the green really needs to be removed for longevity. They might do it but you might not be happy with the result. And still it has corrosion.

Id say if you have your hear set on saving it, and spending money on it likely well above the coins value to do it, give it a go and see what they say.

 

Since the coin is special to you, I would probably have them do it. But I would try to sond someone who would let you piggyback it on their submission to keep the cost down.

 

one more thing, it is a copper coin, the greening, is verdigris. It's copper acetate and copper carbonate and itself is oxidization corrosion as well as a contaminant that will continue to corrode. Any way you do it, it should be removed to save the coin from getting worse really, especially if it's special to you, then the sale value of it really isn't that important to consider as far as the cost of conservation goes so it can be around to pass to another 2 generations.

you can read some info from NGC conservation on this link
https://www.ngccoin.com/ncs-conservation/

read it and look around there to get a better idea of the service.

important to note, that they say "may be be numerically graded or details graded"
and then it goes into hidden damage, corrosion, ect.
toning that covers hairlines from cleaning that once removed makes the cleaning of the coin apparent. things that conservation may uncover that don't currently look as bad can look worse once uncovered.

as far as loss, the mail would lose it if anyone really. insure it for it fair market value, the shipping company won't pay out more than that anyways, usually what it would cost on average to replace it is the maximum.

as far as damage, no, nothing they would do would damage your coin, however, them conserving it may uncover damage that was hidden or less noticeable due to toning.

if it won't benefit the coin to do it, they will not do it.
it will not improve the coin or the grade of it, just improve the eye appeal and stabilize the surface again by removing the affecting contaminants.
if damage is done, it can't be undone.

it can be conserved and get a details grade for "environmental damage", this is a possibility.

 

Any restoration by a TPG you can do yourself, ask the CT experts for advice. If it is precious to you and a not for sale coin clean it, seal it, and enjoy the memories. My opinion only.

 

Thank you all, we wont be doing it anytime soon so I have time to think.

Most of the coins I inherited were stored very poorly (damp shed) so most of the coins are damaged, most also just arent with anything anyway.

I'll contact them soon, making them aware of what I would like done and make it clear that it's much more of a family passion as oppose to somthing we want to sell, and thus we just want the coin conserved. - I read that too, I fully understand this may expose problems, I might not like the finished look etc, so I may consider alternatives, such as saving the money and building on what I already have, such as there was a nice collection of old 1 shillings, I've since managed to acquire a load of new designes to add to the collection. - what I'm saying it, it might be best to cut my losses, save the money and build on the collection getting more shillings, coins of interest, keeping safe what I already have, (acrylic coin capsules) and all around just building on what already exists. - I'll only do this though if its pricey, I just feel like a have a responsibility to care for these coins...
I guess I can only work with what I got, and what I dot was a kilograms of damaged coins

I do have other slightly older coins that got very lucky and seem to be in much better condition than this one.

Thank you all, really appreciate the responses

 

if you want to cut losses, and not put any money into it, simply carrying it around for a while as a pocket piece, handling it and putting a bit more wear on it should get rid of the verdigris and knock it off and it will appear as circulation wear, just normal wear over time, no scratching or scrubbing. maybe some light finger rubbing in the hard to reach spots once in a while, yeah it will get a little more worn, and lower it's "grade" but it's not MS to begin with and you'll leave your mark on it also for it's lineage beside just "keeper of the coin". LOL. it was "sir.birdy.bird's pocket piece"

keeping it sealed up in a coin capsule is actually protecting the surface "as is" and the surface contaminant in a small environment.

you can also check in the ancient or early copper area of this site for copper care information. I mean it will oxidize if you did nothing, it is 165 years old, so there's got to be methods of preservation with oil applications, and likely a product for sale also to maintain the copper surface that collectors use.

Basically if you don't do a conservation service, you should still do something about the verdigris in some fashion to stop it from slowly corroding your coin over time.

 

Can your build on that a little bit:

"keeping it sealed up in a coin capsule is actually protecting the surface "as is" and the surface contaminant in a small environment."

I use capsules as I'm forever getting the coins out and looking at them, as are other people and guests, coin flips probably wont last long with all the handling. It's likely I'm misunderstanding your comment, but I thought coin capsules were a good choice, a little expseive but a good choice for protecting coins.

- somthing will be done though to the coin, it wont be thrown to the back of the draw, its likely it will be handed over to somone who knows how to work with coins.

 

I'll attempt to elaborate but I'm not the best with words to get a point across easily.
the capsule keeps dust and spit and fingerprints, off the coin. it protects it.

However, when there is verdigris on a coin, it's actively "corroding" the surface of the coin and the capsule is keeping it right where it is, protected to do it's thing undisturbed.

capsules or slabs are great to keep a coin from getting wear and keeping stuff of the surfaces, but it's not the best idea for a coin that has verdigris, because the slab or capsule is protecting the verdigris also. you aren't touching it, but whatever the coin came in contact with to cause the copper carbonate to form, it's likely still right there on the coin surface.

It can be actively corroding the coin or not very actively corroding. Probably never totally dormant though, if it's there it's doing something, either fast or slow.

To me verdigris is an active response to a contaminant, while the corrosion is kind of a past tense evidence/damage that's left behind of the activity by verdigris in response to carbon or organic contamination that leaves the corrosion/triggers the copper carbonate formation.

Even slabbed copper coins by grading companies, if kept in poor conditions can get verdigris and require them to be conserved to remove it and reslabbed. if you don't the active verdigris will continue to damage the coin surface and form the green patina to protect it.

Like the statue of liberty is green/blue, that green/blue is verdigris. it's copper carbonate, an ionic compound.... a salt in essence. the coppers outer layer is sacrificing itself due to a contaminant that the copper is trying to protect itself from.

Like the weathering on the statue of liberty, it was copper colored in 1875, by 1900, it was turning green/blue with the copper carbonate patina forming, not as bad as it is today. But up close and personal now, the surface is pitted and corroded a bit under the patina.
this layer of copper carbonate is protecting the rest of the copper underneath sacrificing itself so to speak. it would be desirable on an item like an outdoor statue, not so much on a coin or saxophone though.

 

That makes a lot of sense and that's what I understood, I meant to broadly. Obviously a PVC plastic is a very poor choice and a BIG no for longterm storage, but obviously in this case an acrylic capsule, from my understanding these sort of capsules are fine and will be one of a series of steps you should take to store a coin longterm (no direct sunlight, stable environment etc, make sure the coin isnt reacting to somthing, or doesnt have somthing on the coin that will react etc etc) - I think we are on the same page, I think I just misunderstood that part(my bad), I thought you were imply coin capsules were a poor choice.

 

"Not all that glitters is gold", and not all that is green on a copper coin is harmful. People in the ancient coin forum recognize that some green coloration is not harmful and in many cases adds to the appeal of a coin. The really harmful actor here is what is called "bronze disease" (look it up) which can consume a coin completely. Bronze disease is ascribed to chlorides of copper and is not a protective coating as verdigris may be. For your coin, I would suggest to put a protective plastic net (such as veggies or fruit may come in from the grocery) into a sink so the coin doesn't slip down the drain, put the coin in it and rinse thoroughly with the hottest water that would come out of the tap. After this hot water bath, you might brush lightly with a soft toothbrush or not and repeat the process to remove any loose material. Afterwards, I would soak a couple of hours in distilled water and then rinse with fresh distilled water and thoroughly pat or blot dry (don't rub!). Allow the coin to dry thoroughly (heating to 180 or so degrees F is good) and then return to your acrylic or other capsule.

 

Because the coin has sentimental value to you and you'd like to preserve it, I say, go for it. Since it's not resale value your looking for, you can save some coin and look at pricing for restoration at ANACS Conservation Services. Just a thought.

 

BTW, I really like Victorian coins...what does the lady herself look like on the other side?

 

It's a very attractive coin, my camera is pretty crap and I had to grossly over expose to get a detailed picture. It's a much more even tone in real life and much better looking than these pictures

 

Really love these, my best ones are the India Rupee coins of this era.

 

They'll make their own decisions on what they could or could not try, there is some risk with conservation always though. That said it's a very simple process where you can send it in and ask for conservation to take a look or just for grading and if they think it can help would suggest it. Generally speaking none of the TPGs will try to conserve something if they think it would ruin the coin. Cost wise if you had another you wanted to I would send them both at the same time