Sept. Sev. Emesa......

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by maridvnvm, Aug 29, 2020.

  1. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    I had great hopes of spending some of my reserve funds at the recent CNG Electronic Auction 475, featuring the McAlee collection of eastern mint coins. I had hoped that there were not enough people out there who cared a jot about the eastern Severan issues but my hopes were dashed as I was outbid on every coin I chased after. Was anyone here lucky enough to get anything from the collection?

    I have had to resort to my usual bottom feeding and searching out minor details.

    These two arrived this week and gave me some hope that my collection will continue to grow.

    Septimius Severus denarius

    Obv:– IMP CAE L SEP SEV PERT AVG COS II, Laureate head right
    Rev:– FORTV-N (retrograde) REDVC, Fortuna, with modius on head, standing left holding rudder and cornucopiae
    Minted in Emesa. A.D. 194 - 195
    Reference(s) – BMCRE W352 var. RIC 377 var.. RSC 174a (var)

    4.11gms. 16.77mm. 180 degrees

    There is a bit of corrosion around the N but I cannot see how it can be anything but a retrograde letter. I could of course be wrong (and it wouldn't be the first time)

    RI 064up img.JPG RI 064up revcut.JPG

    Obv:– IMP CAE L SEP SEV PEPT AVG COS II, Laureate head right
    Rev:– MONE AVG, Moneta standing left, holding scales in right hand, cornucopiae in left
    Minted in Emesa. A.D. 194 - 195
    Reference(s) – BMCRE W380 Note. RIC IV 411 Note. RSC 328b. All citing Stariner, 1928-9, page 199, No. 12.

    The E is there but looks like there have been issues with the die even though the rest of the reverse die looks relatively fresh

    2.94gms. 19.09mm. 0 degrees

    RI 064uq img.JPG
    RI 064uq rev66.JPG
    Martin
     
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  3. Restitutor

    Restitutor Well-Known Member

    I snagged these two, should be arriving Tuesday. Hopefully they don’t assassinate each other in transit :)

    74BB8A37-F081-419C-9FAB-C883D891113E.jpeg 11B3CA3F-75E7-48B8-9A22-94ADC28E0509.jpeg
     
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  4. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Outbid on everything.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2020
  5. Agricantus

    Agricantus Allium aflatunense

    Such a large selection of easter mint denarii. It should've been easy to get my targets. But no, nada, zero. I ended up buying a greek coin as consolation.
     
  6. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    Monday night, I was leading on eight but seven of those fell to last minute bids. The one I won was an Alexandria. IMO the best coins in the sale were lower grade but those and the better grade, more common items went too high. It may be time to hold off collecting until the people spending their travel funds drop out if/when Covid ever ends. The best coin in the sale IMHO was the VICTOR IVST AVG IICOS which was not nearly as nice as the maridvnvm example. One could argue the relative merits of the Minerva holding an owl that hammered at $900 + extras. Before this sale, I had not seen one other than mine (die dupe) that I bought decades ago for $80 (then only double the price of a common type). Mine has a crack but slightly better detail. I thought $200 was enough for it. Two others disagreed.
    rg2170bb1736.jpg

    'Emesa' was my prime interest but I will have to console myself playing with the ones I have. This sale has driven me to reorganizing my ID numbers to make it easier to tell what I have. That will take a while so I can stop chasing coins I will not win.
     
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  7. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    I went what I thought was strong on three coins, missed one by a long way and watched others like the Minerva owl with eyes agog.

    The II C / BONI EVENTVS, grain ear between crossed cornucopiae as I am missing this interesting reverse in this series
    The II C / FORTVNE R DVCI, which I am also missing in this series and I have an AVG obverse with a reverse die match
    The IMP CA L SE SEV PER AVG COS II / MINER VI CTRI as I am still chasing various of these short legends and the Minerva reverse is one I don't have for this series
    I did go for the COS II / FELICIT TEMPOR, basket of fruits but was nowehere near where it ended up
     
  8. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    I've been wanting an Alexandria mint Sep Sev, but I didn't want to pay too much for one. The result :

    Sep Sev - McAlee Alexandria.jpg Septimius Severus. AD 193-211. AR Denarius (18mm, 2.79 g, 12h). Alexandria mint. Struck AD 194. IMP CAE L SE P SEV PERT AVG, laureate head right / BONI E V ENTVS, Bonus Eventus standing left, holding plate of fruit and grain ears. Bickford-Smith p. 55-6; RIC IV 347; BMCRE 321; RSC 66. VF.
    From the Richard McAlee Collection.

    It wasn't my favorite in the auction (lot 475 was), but it was the second cheapest, and I think I'll be happy with it. I liked the Alexandria mint Clodius Albinus as well.
     
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  9. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

  10. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    The Alexandrian Mars type is one of my favourites. So much so that I have somehow acquired multiples....

    Obv:– IMP CAE L SEP SEV PERT AVG, Laureate head right
    Rev:– TR P IIII IMP II COS II, Mars standing right, resting on spear and shield
    Minted in Alexandria, A.D. 194
    References:– BMCRE -, RIC -, RSC -. RIN (Rivista Italiana di Nvmismatica Vol. XCVI (1994/1995)

    2.72g. 17.78mm. 0o

    Additional information from Curtis Clay:-
    "Die match to example in British Museum, found at the site of a Roman villa in Kent, GB, in 1952. The same obv. die also occurs with the types MONETA AVG and LEG III IT AVG TR P COS.
    Bickford-Smith recorded three other specimens, of which I also have plaster casts: his own coll. (probably now in BM), Klosterneuburg, and U.S. private collection. On these the rev. legend apparently ends COS rather than COS II.
    This type was clearly struck in 194, when Septimius was TR P II and IMP III or IIII, so TR P IIII IMP II in the rev. legend is an error, the origin of which is obvious: the type is a rote copy of the identical type and legend on denarii of Lucius Verus of 164, Cohen 228-9. The titles apply to Lucius in 164, not Septimius in 194!"

    [​IMG]

    this one looks like a double die match to the one you were after

    [​IMG]

    Same obverse, different reverse die?

    [​IMG]

    This one with decent clear legends.

    [​IMG]
     
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  11. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    I did not bid on lot 475 because it is a coin that requires die matching to identify. That basic type comes with two reverse legends. CNG quoted the one ending in COS but there are also coins ending in COSII. I have not done the die research to see if they were right. Both of my coins are real stinkers.

    Well, I type too slow so all I have left to do is show the photos.

    COSII
    rf0440b01661lg.jpg

    COS
    rf0450b00148lg.jpg
    This last one was one of my two Alexandria coins Roger Bickford-Smith offered to buy for $250 each in 1989. He repeated more than once that offer but eventually gave up and asked that I tell my daughter she should remember him should I pass. This type is easier to find today and this thread has shown several including the ones with clear COS but no II which is why Roger wanted my coin. I believe I am correct in the ones with COS II were made earlier than the COS coins which use the later style portrait if Roger's separations were correct. For what it is worth, the dating devices on this coin are meaningless. The type, including legends, was copied from the coin below of Lucius Verus. The Alexandria mint closed before 196 when Septimius would have been TRP IIII and, if it were open then, the IMP number would have been higher than II. Yes, as a matter of fact, that is why I bought that Lucius Verus coin.
    rc2370bb1120.jpg
     
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  12. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    IMHO, the relative prices on the Alexandrian coins followed the correct level by rarity as I see them. Another tip is that Mr. McAlee was like me in that he would buy a poor coin if he lacked the type so some of his worst coins were among the most rare. I really expected to win raggedy lot 163 but at least two people were aware of the type and wanted it worse than I did. This series was a lot more fun before so many people learned about it.
     
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  13. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    My first coin shown above is the only one I am convinced can be read as a COS II without needing a die match.
     
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  14. Alex22

    Alex22 Active Member

    Great coins! Here is my Septimius Severus denarius from Emesa to keep them a company:

    SeptSev_Emesa.png
    Denarius of Septimius Severus, 194 AD - 195 AD, Emesa (Hemesa, Syria region, Roman Empire) mint, RIC.IV.ss.399; RCV(2000).6305; RSC.283; BMC.375. Obv.: IMP CAE L SEP SEV PERT AVG COS II, head of Septimius Severus, laureate, right. Rev.: LIBERA AVG, Liberalitas, draped, standing left, holding abacus in right hand and cornucopiae in left hand.
     
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  15. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

  16. Shea19

    Shea19 Well-Known Member

    I struck out on all of the Severans, but I was lucky to win a few lots from his collection from later in the 3rd Century. I was fully expecting to get shut out on everything, so I was very happy to come away with these. I ended up winning a lot of 4 Gordians (love his Antioch-style portraits), a great Volusian ant, and the Philip II ant below. Hopefully should have them in hand later this week, I’m excited.

    09A43CE5-9A94-407A-B20F-8BBE9405F185.jpeg
    Philip II. AD 247-249. AR Antoninianus (21mm, 3.12 g), Antioch mint. 1st issue. IMP M IVL PHILIPPVS AVG, radiate, draped, and cuirassed bust right, seen from behind / AEQVITAS AVG, Aequitas standing left, holding scales and cornucopia. Bland Study 61; RIC IV 240a var. (rev. legend).
    From the Richard McAlee collection.
     
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  17. Alex22

    Alex22 Active Member

    I think no. The obverse is different, the reverse dies seemed really similar (letter styles, general positions, same celator?), but see how the two red axes relate to the positions of the letters (horizontal ones drawn for each coin at the level of the Liberalitas eye, and the vertical ones at the point the deity holds the abacus).

    die_comparison.png
     
  18. Sulla80

    Sulla80 Well-Known Member

    Reviving this thread to add a BONI EVENTVS from Emesa (ex EBay ex Forvm - is there any way to lookup an old forvm ancient coins ID number?) :
    Sept Severus Boni Eventus.jpg
    Septimius Severus, AD 193-211, AR denarius, Emesa mint, struck AD 194-195
    Obv: IMP CAE L SEP SEV PERT AVG COS II, laureate head right
    Ref: BONI E VENTV S, Bonus Eventus standing left, holding basket of fruit and two grain ears
    Size: 2.82g, 17.6mm (12 die axis)
    Ref: RIC IV 369

    With the S in E VENTV S coming at the tip of the grain it is easy to spot similar dies (although no die matches found, and I am not sure there is any useful information in the ones that I did find with same spacing, not COS II, and one Julia D).

    https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=83555
    [​IMG]
    https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=121901
    [​IMG]

    https://www.acsearch.info/search.html?id=7243507
    [​IMG]
     
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