Determining Authenticity of Trade Dollar from eBay

Have a 1876-S Trade Dollar that I recently won on eBay enroute. Seller said that his father had picked it up while he was working in Indo-China many years ago. Does have a 100% rating with over 700 transactions.

Purposely did not show the coin's photos because you can't really tell much about the coin from the picture.

I have always been suspicious of bogus Trade Dollars and am even more so now that I have one of my own to examine.

I need some advice on what to look for when the coin arrives. Fortunately I have the excellent picture below to use as reference.

I do know to check the weight although that may be off a little since the coin will be in a stapled 2X2.

Also know to check whether or not the substructure material is magnetic (better not be).

That is the extent of my expertise, and any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. BTW the coin will grade out at XF.

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Someone should be along shortly....GD?

 

Please post good pictures when the coin arrives.

For the record, and sight unseen, I'd say chances are the coin is a countefeit.

I hope luck is on your side....Mike

p.s. I'm no trade dollar expect, but most of the countefeits I've seen show weakness in the wheat stalks to the bottom right of lady Liberty, and odd dentils. This is by no means authoritative, however.

 

Which is precisely why I am being proactive and getting the best input I can before the coin arrives.

Fortunately, it has a full money-back guarantee that I won't hesitate to use if I have even the slighest doubt. Will most definitely get some good scans to post for everyones' review along with measured weight (assuming it is correct).

Following are the eBay photos:

 

If it is from China, you can basically guarantee that the coin is not going to be authentic. There are several posts on this forum about the counterfeit rings that operate in China. I hope you didn't pay too much for it.

 

Story was that the man's father worked in Indo-China (now Cambodia) 50+ years ago and this was a coin that he brought back with him.

Source is in Central US, not China. Story sounds good, but I've been around long enough to question just about everything.

 

The field looks rather grainy - a possible indication of a cast coin.

As far as weighing, if your scale has a tare feature, just weigh an empty 2x2 and three staples, then set the scale to zero and remove the 2x2 and staples. Then when you weigh the dollar and 2x2 combo you'll be getting just the weight of the coin. It should weigh 27.22 grams.

 

I suspect the coin is fake. The date looks all wrong to my eyes.

 

I would concur with Leadfoot. The fields also do not look quite right. The picture isn't the best, so can't tell for sure.

 

If the weight and non-magnetic attraction tests pass, I'll be posting some detailed scans of the coin.

Have already notified the seller that the majority of uncertified Trade Dollars sold on eBay are bogus and that he has ever had the coin previously returned or has any suspicion that the coin is not legitimate to just return the money and make everything easier on everyone.

 

On some of the struck counterfiets from China the weight is right on , on some of the best ones the reeding is wider then on the real ones . I took one I recently bought to the man who wrote the Coin World article on the Chinese counterfiets , he compared mine to a no. of real TDs and told me he thought it was counterfiet , but there was no one thing that jumped out at him and pointed to counterfiet , and that the only way to tell was to do more sophisticated tests . Also check the eagles eyes , on the fakes I think the whole eye is incused where on the real ones just the eyeball is incused . Best to have it authenticated or if he won't let you leave it alone .
rzage

 

excellent point and if the SME cannot tell whehter its counterfeit with 100% confidence in hand its difficult to authenticate from the bench. best case scenario its a crude counterfeit that we determine from the photos whenthe coin arrives worst case you send it to a TPG and pray.

 

Only thing i can add is to look 4 bubbles between the denticles caused from casting. Hope all turns out well.

 

Appreciate everyone's valuable input and observations. Right now I just need to get the coin in for inspection, run a few tests, and get some good scans and/or photos for everyone to look at.

With a little luck, I may have something to post by Friday at the latest.

Stay tuned ...

 

I have had friends buy Trade dollars on ebay and all turned out counterfeit. My best advice would be to

1) Buy certified
2) Buy from a known dealer or numismatic auction house.

 

I agree with what everyone else has said here. In particular like Leadfoot I don't like the date. When I blow the image up I see a gap at the top of the eight.

 

The pictire is so low in resolution that any magnification makes every area on the coin look terrible.

As far as there being a gap at the top of the 8 ... there better not be or back she goes. :vanish:

 

I look at most of the Trade dollars on eBay, and have bought some there- both real and fake. The Chinese figured out long ago how to get the correct weight, so if it is about 27g don't stop there. The forgers have the most trouble with the dentils. They should be very uniform; if any are too long or short, or especially if they have tiny holes/pits in them, it is a fake. The rim should be about a dentils length wide. I often see weakness in Liberty's seat, the wheat sheaf, and gown. The letters and numbers should rise sharply from the background, and have flat tops. If they look rounded, beware.The stars should be nearly identical, and not look like 5 grains of rice end to end.Forgers often don't do a good job on reeding, so check the edge for uniformity.
On the item in question, I see some problems with dentil shapes, fields look bumpy,and some letters look rounded and imperfectly formed. There may be some bridging between 2 of the arrow shafts. The rims look a little fat to me. While I suspect it is a copy, this is just based on some not-so-great photos, so if it passes the weight check I will be very interested in seeing your pictures. FYI: avoid all CC trade dollars raw on ebay, unless from a very trusted seller, and even then caution is advised!

 

Sometimes ebay sellers that use stories about coins, ie, "from my personal collection", or " unsearched roll from my grandmother" that send red flags. A legit seller needs no stories about the coins they are selling.

Not knowing what you paid for the coin, if you need peace of mind, have it slabbed. Keep the seller informed and if it is not authentic he should refund your purchase.

 

FWIW i bought my trade dollar off ebay and even the doubting thomases of the forum were happy with it. buy the coin not the slab not the TPG not the previous owners reputation not the platform. I cant stress this enough know your coins before you spend your hard earned money on them