To CAC or not to CAC - official game thread

1884-O NGC 61 Dollar fatty holder - yes / CAC gold. It is 62-63. Super luster exquisite gold toning.

 

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On the Morgan I'll say Green CAC.

Can I upload a coin at some point? I have an interesting one...I think.

jom

 

If it didn't get a star designation then it would probably get a green bean.

 

Gold bean on that Morgan. No way that it is a 61.

 

I've got similar notes for some submissions so maybe I can do a few of mine after you've done all of yours.

jom

 

Yes you will be next after mainebill (who follows the current coin posted)

 

My general guidance was 24 hours until reveal but that can be extended if participation is low or if the poster wants to.


As for unknowns, we have had three so far. I do agree it’s best when we have knowns, but there is also some value in having a CoinTalk pre-CAC opinion (might not be accurate but still informative and fun).

 

Not entirely sure what you mean by this, but CAC is completely independent of the star. The CAC sticker ignores any Star or Plus designation and just verifies the base grade.

 

I understand that. I was just saying that the star is NGCs way of saying the coin is exceptional for the grade; in this case MS 67. If NGC didn't have a star designation then I'd bet that a coin like this sent to CAC would get a green bean.

 

I'm a bit confused by this. As Jason said earlier CAC and the NGC star are independent so why would it matter whether NGC "starred" the coin or not for CAC to give it a bean?

jom

 

While there can be overlap, the two can be quite different. For a coin to CAC, it has to be A or B for the grade while a star can be given for a coin that is low end for the grade (see quote and article below). The Star is for eye appeal while the sticker is for grade (which factors in more than just eye appeal).

“NGC defines its star () designated coins as those that have exceptional eye appeal. The coin itself could fall anywhere within the grade it is assigned, i.e.: if it were an MS 64 it could be at the lower end, mid-range or higher end of that grade.“

https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/806/

 

I see (pun intended). Thanks for educating me on this.

 

Slightly off-topic.....Laura Sperber of Legends is a part-owner of CAC ? Are other high-end dealers part-owners ?

 

Bruce Morelan (one of the big collectors) and Laura were both financially involved when it started. From various posts I've seen over the years on the PCGS forums, both of them are no longer invested directly.

 

Summary

Rd. 1: 1921 MS 65 Green CAC Morgan--> Yes: 4 vs No: 3

Rd. 2: 1835 AU 50 Green CAC 50c--> Yes: 2 vs No: 8

Rd. 3: 1939-S Oregon MS 65 Gold CAC 50c--> Yes: 10 (8 Green and 2 Gold) vs No: 0

Rd. 4: 1838 AU 58 Green CAC (Gold $5)--> Yes: 1 vs No: 5

Rd. 5: 1908 MS 63 Green CAC (Gold $20)—> Yes: 5 vs No: 1

Rd. 6: 1885-CC MS 63 PL Green CAC Morgan--> Yes: 8 vs No: 1

Rd. 7: 1946-S MS 66 Green CAC Walker 50c--> Yes: 7 (6 Green and 1 Gold) vs No: 1

Rd. 8: 1885-S MS 62 NOT CAC Morgan--> Yes: 5 (4 Green and 1 Gold) vs No: 1

Rd. 9: 1830 EF 45 UNKNOWN CAC 50c--> Yes: 10 vs No: 1

Rd. 10*: 1899 MS 65 BN UNKNOWN CAC 1c--> Yes: 4 vs No: 5

Rd. 11: 1942 MS 65 Gold CAC 50c--> Yes: 4 (4 Green and 0 Gold) vs No: 2

Rd. 12: 1940-D MS 67 Star UNKNOWN CAC 10c--> Yes: 3 vs No: 4

Green CAC on coin and deserves it: 4
Green CAC on coin and doesn't deserve it: 2
Gold CAC on coin and deserves it:
Gold CAC on coin but should only be Green: 2
Gold CAC on coin but should not sticker:
Failed to sticker but deserves a sticker: 1
Failed to sticker and should not sticker:
Unknown sticker status and deserves a sticker:1
Unknown sticker status and does not deserve a sticker:2


Note: if we don’t know the status of a coin before the reveal and more people say green CAC for a gold CAC coin, then it will go in the area of “Gold CAC on coin but should only be Green” ....see round 3 as the example case

*Rd. 10 was 4-4...I interpreted that CircCam would consider it a no (based on a similar example), which swayed the overall vote to a lean towards no.

 

Last call on opinions for the Morgan posted by @geekpryde ....
(I updated summary info up through the Star Mercury Dime)

 

Green CAC for the 84-O Morgan. Really nice for a 61, but not close enough to 63 to score a gold bean.