ICG beat out PCGS this week

This weeks graysheet

PCGS: 83.28%
NGC: 81.16%
ANACS: 56.29%
ICG: 83.47%
PCI: 52.13%
SEGS: 50.98%
NCI: 41.17%
INS: 29.08%

Now I have a quick question. Is it worth joining PCGS as a member, I have a lot of coins I would like to have graded. Which level of membership would you best reccomend for someone on a college student budget.

 

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I am a big fan of ICG. I think their slab with the Intercept Shield offers second to none protectioin. Their service is good as well.

Their grading for coins below MS67 is right on whereas I think they are too liberal for grades above MS68. The same holds for Proof coins...there seems to be a lot of PR70 coins in their "inventory". Their employees are NOT allowed to own coins and all in all, they do a great job.

So why would I submit coins to PCGS instead of ICG? Put it this way...IF I am going to pay a silver membership of $49 and submission fees of $18 to $30/coin for your basic service, it is because I KNOW that if I had to sell the coin, the prices I will get for that coin in a PCGS holder is far greater than NGC, ICG and ANACS. The rest of the services I wouldn't waste my money submitting to, though I have picked up some nice coins in PCI and SEGS holders at prices far less than what I would pay if they were in PCGS or NGC holders.

Look at any auction house like Heritage, PCGS coins all have prices realized much higher than NGC, ANACS, ICG, etc.

Blame it on hype, registry sets, marketing, or whatever, the FREE MARKET has spoken.

So...use your money wisely and submit to the service you know that will obtain the highest returns (if you had to liquidate).

I just sold a 1924-D AU55 Lincoln graded by ANACS and I have one listed graded by PCGS, also a AU55. Guess which is obtaining (way more) higher dollars realized? Again, the market speaks!

 

Send then to ANACS...you can get the 5 day service and if you send more than 5 you get it for $15 per coin....its cheaper than PCGS or ICG.

www.anacs.com

Speedy

 

Spend a little more up front and you recover these costs later. Just look at prices realized for a 1914-D Lincoln Cent for just the last couple of months with the various grading services.

Date - Grade - Service - Price Realized (c/o Heritage Auctions)

August 1, 2005 25 NGC $345.00
August 1, 2005 30 ANACS $373.75
August 1, 2005 45 ANACS $517.50
August 1, 2005 45 PCGS $747.50
July 30, 2005 64 NGC $3,105.00
July 24, 2005 30 NGC $359.95
July 19, 2005 20 PCGS $299.00
July 17, 2005 8 ANACS $126.50
July 17, 2005 4 ANACS $103.50
July 12, 2005 20 ANACS $287.50
July 5, 2005 55 NGC $1,207.50
July 4, 2005 55 PCGS $1,380.00
July 4, 2005 30 ANACS $345.00
July 4, 2005 50 PCGS $1,092.50
July 4, 2005 12 ANACS $230.00
July 3, 2005 15 ANACS $184.00
June 30, 2005 45 PCGS $690.00
June 30, 2005 40 NGC $488.75
June 30, 2005 58 PCGS $1,955.00
June 28, 2005 8 ANACS $161.00
June 6, 2005 15 NGC $276.00
June 6, 2005 12 ANACS $230.00
June 6, 2005 30 ANACS $431.25
June 6, 2005 20 ANACS $299.00
June 5, 2005 15 ANACS $172.50
June 3, 2005 53 ANACS $1,265.00
June 3, 2005 55 PCGS $1,495.00
May 31, 2005 4 ANACS $100.05
May 24, 2005 4 ANACS $118.45
May 24, 2005 4 ANACS $121.90
May 22, 2005 15 NGC $276.00
May 17, 2005 15 NGC $253.00
May 9, 2005 15 PCGS $264.50
May 9, 2005 12 ANACS $184.00
May 9, 2005 12 ANACS $253.00
May 9, 2005 45 ANACS $747.50
May 9, 2005 20 ANACS $299.00
May 9, 2005 20 ANACS $195.50
May 8, 2005 12 ANACS $207.00
May 8, 2005 8 ANACS $149.50
May 8, 2005 8 ANACS $109.25
May 8, 2005 4 ANACS $103.50
May 8, 2005 4 ANACS $86.25
May 7, 2005 65 NGC $3,881.25
May 7, 2005 40 PCGS $546.25
May 7, 2005 40 ANACS $488.75
May 7, 2005 40 ANACS $517.50

How about 1909-VDB (no S)?

August 9, 2005 64 NGC $51.00
August 7, 2005 66 PCGS $172.50
August 7, 2005 65 ANACS $69.00
August 1, 2005 65 PCGS $97.75
August 1, 2005 66 PCGS $161.00
August 1, 2005 66 PCGS $149.50
July 30, 2005 67 PCGS $1,092.50
July 30, 2005 67 PCGS $1,265.00
July 12, 2005 66 NGC $149.50
July 10, 2005 66 NGC $132.25
July 5, 2005 66 NGC $132.25
July 5, 2005 64 ANACS $48.00
July 4, 2005 66 PCGS $253.00
July 3, 2005 66 NGC $92.00
July 3, 2005 65 NGC $66.00

Now of course there are some exceptions, but if it were me and I were submit coins, I would use PCGS just for the sure knowledge that if I had to sell them, I know they net more than the other services. That is how the market is. Could it change? Sure it could, but past performance is a pretty good indicator of things to come...not always, but these are REAL numbers.

If I buy coins, I try to get the best coin I can. If that means buying a PCI coin, breaking it out and submitting it so that it is in a PCGS holder, I also do that! Even after buying it, breaking it out, and selling it, I cover my costs...plus some.

So...think about why you are submitting? Is it authentication? Protection? Presentation? Opinion of the coin's grade? All of the above?

Also think about if you were to sell off your collection, which holders would you rather have your coins in?

So spend the extra $5 to $10 per coin because you will recover that and more in the long run...easily!

 

Another way of looking at the same data...

67 PCGS $1,265.00
67 PCGS $1,092.50
66 PCGS $253.00
66 PCGS $172.50
66 PCGS $161.00
66 PCGS $149.50
66 NGC $149.50
66 NGC $132.25
66 NGC $132.25
66 NGC $92.00
65 PCGS $97.75
65 ANACS $69.00
65 NGC $66.00
64 NGC $51.00
64 ANACS $48.00

 

Agree to a point. The question is where to submit to? If you take your "prices realized" less the slabbing cost of whatever service, if you net more for a PCGS coin over other services, that is good for the submitter and owner of the given coin.

All in all, the PCGS graded coins obtain more (even after the submission fees) for their coins than the other services, so if I were to submit a coin for authentication, grading and liquidity, I just can't ignore the maket prices obtained by a PCGS slabbed coin.

Now if I were to buy the coin, I look at the coin itself and try to find the best deal. As stated, I have bought some PCI, SEGS graded coins, kept them for awhile, broke them out and submitted them off to PCGS. Even a coin graded MS66 by PCI came back MS64 from PCGS was worh more than what I paid for it after submission costs and all. Sometimes PCI or SEGS coins are right in line with PCGS and if they "cross", I am a happy camper.

Now, I break out the coin as most PCI and SEGS coins don't even cross at a designated minumum grade when they are in their holders. My experience is if I submit them raw, I have better success of obtaining the proper grade that when they are in their holder. Call it PCGS being prejudiced against other TPG's, but that has been my experience...and a costly one too!

You are right, it is attention away from the coin. I wish that all grading services grade coins like the government grades gasoline. But the fact of the matter is that the market has spoken and I can't fight it. I like ICG slabs for my coins better than PCGS, but when it comes time to sell (as WE are all short term owners of our coins and Earthly possessions), I know that my coins will fare much better than NGC which will fare better than ANACS which will fare better than ICG which will fare better than...(you get the point)...

...all things being equal...which is hard to do in coins based on market forces, timing, released hoards, and the holy grail...GRADING!

 

This is just about the same conclusion I've been coming to recently, so I'm very happy to read it from a more knowledgeable source. It's a solution that certainly solves more problems than it creates for the casual collector like me.

This has been a great thread and extremely helpful to read both sides of the debate. Thanks.

 

Yeah, I agree, when you "join the TPGS clubs" you really look at the world through rose colored glasses. Registry sets-what a joke for anyone who falls for that sham. It is just one other way the TPGSs fleece the collecting community and lulling them into buying the grade printed on the plastic-not the coin, creating false percieved value and making collectors more addicted to market grading instead of doing the grading themselves. I don't pay extra for a coin because it is in one TPGS holder or another and will never submit coins unless it really really makes sense when I am hoping to sell.

 

This weeks graysheet

PCGS: 83.28%
NGC: 81.16%
ANACS: 56.29%
ICG: 83.47%
PCI: 52.13%
SEGS: 50.98%
NCI: 41.17%
INS: 29.08%


please translate?
What do the percentages refer to?

 

the thred is back after 3 years

someone correct me if i am wrong the percentage refers to the price realised of actual for sight unseen coins so if your coin was worth 100 then you got 83.28 from pcgs holders and 83.47 from icg holders

 

I'm really starting to like ICG more and more. I've picked up ceritifed coins by them that would sell for WAY more if they were PCGS/NGC.
I got 3 Sacageweas, all ICG certified, and the grades seem to me to be SPOT on. What blew me away though was the price I got them for:
2000-D Sacagewea MS68- $11.00
2001-D Sacagewea MS68- $10.50
2002-S Sacagewea PR70DCAM- $30.00

On top of that I've picked up a 2003 Silver Eagle MS70 for $35

Tell me that isn't ridiculous? I really hope ICG catches on BIG TIME with collector's someday, so I can sit back and chuckle.

 

To be meaningful, they need a much, much larger sample size. Instead of 20 ratios, they would need 2,000 ratios. 400 US Coin issues, 5 grades each.

 

Unfortunately I will someday start slabbing a lot of my coins. This will be to benefit my wife should I pass on earlier. I want HER to get the most that she can out of them.
Therefore PCGS or NGC at this point.

If I knew I was going to die two years from today, for example, the best would go to PCGS and the rest to NGC.

If I knew I would live forever 2x2s would be my choice of "plastic".

Who knows - people may actually start collecting coins again some day.

clembo