Bad 1917 Quarter Bouncing Around

It is funny how this coin keeps popping up.

July 12th I bought a 1917 Standing Liberty Quarter that was heavily whizzed and weighing it at .23 ozs....Maybe fake. I returned the coin without any problem and informed the seller of the coin who doesn't seem to know much about coins.

$185. 7-12-08. Original Purchase Returned
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330250671270

July 21st it is resold without any mention of the underweight or heavy whizzing.

$156. 7-21. New Buyer
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330255028558


Now the buyer who buys and sells a lot of coins, a person you would expect to be aware of the whizzing has re listed the coin for $250. No mention of whizzing.

$250 8-9
http://cgi.ebay.com/1917-TYPE-1-STA...rms=39:1|66:3|65:1&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14.l1318


Sad.....................

 

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I agree. Of course I would not mind if the whizzing was mentioned.

 

Interesting to say the least

 

A cheat, is a cheat, is a cheat!!!

 

99 whizzed SLQs on the wall, 99 whizzed SLQs, bid one down, pass it around, 98 whizzed SLQs on the wall...

 

Wow, that really is terrible. Even more sad, the pics are clearly taken to hide the whizzed surfaces. The only hint of it (at least that I can see) is the "aura" around the eagle on the reverse.

Even more concerning, the buyer in the second link (and seller in the last), left good feedback for the original seller.

He said:

 

Ok...since I'm still in the learning stage with a lot of coins, what's whizzing refering to??

I don't see Lady Liberty urinating.

 

Basically, someone took a cloth or other abrasive material and polished the coin with it. From a distance, or with bad pics (or with an untrained eye)...the coin may look like luster...but up close many fine lines can be seen. It is damage to the coin.

Here is an example from my collection. This Bust Half is quite shinny, and the overall details of the coin aren't bad. Someone unfamiliar with coins might think this shine is a natural luster. However, if you look close, you can see many fine lines in the coin.

 

From PCGS's OFFICIAL GUIDE TO COIN GRADING AND COUNTERFEIT DETECTION, whizzing is defined as: "the process of mechanically moving the metal of a lightly circulated coin to simulate luster. Usually accomplished by using a wire brush attachment on a high-speed drill"

Don't worry Steve, I know exactly what you are thinking: that's nice, but what does it look like on an actual coin. This is a Barber Half Dollar that has been whizzed. At first glance, the coin looks like a very nice uncirculated example. Closer examination shows the truth, a severly, but expertly whizzed coin. Now look back at the overhead photo, and the whizzing is apparent.





Don't worry guys, I paid AU money for the coin. Even though it is whizzed, it is still a very detailed and attractive coin.

 

Oh wow, I probably wouldn't have even noticed that. That is amazing. The couple coins in my collection that are whizzed (or at least I know they are) are more of the "harshly cleaned" variety.

 

Ahh, yes I see. Thanks Lehigh and Richie. Very helpful.

I think I have a raw Morgan that's whizzed. I guess it is pretty apparent on the Standing Lib. I'm surprised it's going for that much. Either the seller doesn't know, or like other's have said, he's trying to just rip someone off. It's too bad there's people like that.

 

Actually, I don't think it is apparent at all on the SLQ. The photos are too far away to show the whizzing. If the coin is whizzed, then the doctor has accomplished his goal at least in those photos, because the coin looks BU to me. I would never bid on an raw item on E-Bay with small photos like that, you are practically inviting the problem coin into your house.

 

I don't know... I guess when I just see a coin like that uncertified I always assume there has to be something up with it. Unless it's a very trustworthy seller who deals a lot with raw, higher-end coins that are BU.

I figured that one out pretty quick. I try to avoid raw U.S. coins except when buying big lots to put together rolls.

 

I am right there with you man. All my coins are rainbow toned and they are all graded by either PCGS or NGC. I have just 2 ANACS coins. All of my raw coins are album coins and usually very inexpensive.

 

I heavily agree with your observations Lehigh. The pics looked fine, but in hand is the best.

Mercury dimes are my passion and I've seen way too many whizzed ones to remember them all. I had to sadly inform a few of my coin club members that their coins have been whizzed. I always feel bad for them when they see it for what it is and then realize the disappointment.

Allen

 

I own several SLQ's and before purchasing the coin I copied the picture and enlarge it through Photoshop as well as checking for Autolevel enhancement. This is a good trick to get a better idea of the actual coin. I was a little concerned with what I originally figured to be a weak struck reverse as the edge of the wing did not seem like wear that would be consistent with the obverse. As soon as the coin came out of the envelope the obverse stood out as whizzed and once I turned over the coin it was even worse on the reverse.

Without a loop I noticed the whizzed surfaces and under a loop it looked as if the whizzing was done with a soft brass wheel on a dremel rotary tool.


Needless to say I wouldn't have taken the chance if a return policy wasn't allowed, but the seller did return my money promptly along with S&H both ways.

This new seller is something else. I hope it doesn't sell, but odds are eventually it will sell to a new collector that will not realize it is whizzed and although the newest buyer may initially enjoy it, there will come a day where they realize that the coin isn't original.

As I mentioned earlier the trick with copying and enlarging as well as changing brightness/contrast can determine a good buy from a bad buy. Three or four years ago I bought a 1835 rainbow Bust 25c that had pictures which were dark and from a distance. I enlarged the photo for a better view, Hue saturation provided a better idea of the color pattern to determine if it was AT, and changing contrast levels enhances nicks, scratches, and wear. The 1835 25c was purchased for $200 and now resides in a NGC MS61 Holder.

This was my best purchase off Ebay, but overall this trick has helped me from buying a lot of junk. Maybe this technique will help some of you.

 

Whizzed or not, if the price was right on that 1917 SLQ I would buy it because it is an attractive piece with a full head, has all of the stars on the shield visible, and no sign of wear anywhere. Examples with as much detail showing as that are hard to find. Of course, if the piece has indeed been whizzed then it will not slab with PCGS or NGC and the owner will need to be happy owning it in the raw.

 

Out of curiosity what would be your offered priced for the Whizzed 1917 SLQ knowing that is is whizzed?

 

I would go $90. Maybe a little higher if the coin actually looks as attractive in hand as it does in the pics.

 

My luck is that I already own a 1917 T1 SLQ and don't have to worry about it.



NGC MS65 FH