"The Ottomans" on Netflix now.

I would argue that you have to concede their 'Romanness' in order to grasp who they were. It's clear that they saw themselves as the heirs to Rome and made that part of their identity. They can still be Romans without being Classical Romans. They weren't Greeks, because their identity had been fundamentally changed by their incorporation into the Roman Empire. The process of assimilation @Voulgaroktonou mentions changed them in a lot of ways, but it's ultimately what defined them.

The speech by Constantine XI, which they show a bit of in the show and which invokes the Punic Wars, Augustus, Constantine, and Justinian, really taps into that identity. There's some question of its authenticity, but the fact that it was attributed to the emperor shows that it is a plausible representation of their identity.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

I like keeping it simple. I thought the Byzantine Empire and the Roman Empire were two separate unrelated entities before. Now, I know it was always just the Roman Empire.

It's amazing how because of how vast the Empire was, how much time it spanned, and how much it evolved over time that we have to decide on the names to give it at different time periods just to distinguish if we're talking about the times of Julius Caesar and Augustus, Diocletian, or Justinian.

 

Many years ago I attended a lecture by a Greek "Byzantine" historian who told of an event that led him to his profession. He was a child on a Greek island when it was liberated from the Turks in the 19th c. He related how, as the Greek marines were debarking from their boats onto the shore, he, like the local populace, was waiving a Greek flag and was shouting "Οι Ελληνες, Οι Ελληνες" - "The Greeks, the Greeks!". He said that a marine came up to him and replied "Δεν είμαστε Ελληνες, είμαστε Ρωμαίοι." = "we are not Greeks, we are Romans." It was that sense of continuity that propelled him into a life of scholarship of the Roman empire.

 

Great fun, and thanks to all who got involved in this subject. I will indeed check out the movie. As the marine said "...we are not Greeks, we are Romans."

 

I finally started watching the Ottomans on Netflix last night. Got up to the point where they fired the first cannon shot - pretty cool. I also liked the description of the jannisaries - young boys from Christian homes taken by the Devshirme and trained as warriors after converting to Islam. Byzantium was probably a bit too sumptuous given that it had been ransacked by the Crusaders in 1204 and everything not nailed down was taken down or melted. Constantine was ruling a tottering city of perhaps half the population that Constantinople once had, which would only muster 7,000 troops to oppose the Ottomans and man the Theodosian walls. Anybody else start watching it?

 

I watched it all.....loved it. The hero was the young Sultan. He took on a huge challenge as a teenager.