Nazi Germany or Native American symbol countermark?

To hopefully clear a few things up - this is the email I received from Dr Denise Neil, Director of the 45th infantry museum (“Clark” is the head curator at the museum)
Also to clarify some of the things she’s is saying - when she mentions the swastika and “original insignia” she is referring to the 45th original insignia which was a swatika in square orientation before the war
And became the thunderbird in 1938

Hi Tyler,


Thanks again for sending the high res images. It was nice to see the coin in greater detail.


From my perspective, the coin is likely a one off memento of a 45th member. There is really know other way to explain the attempt to strike a Thunderbird on the front. The swastika on the back of the coin, which was done with precision, is interesting, and the angle is in keeping with the orientation of the original insignia. The arrow (s) are also interesting. All these symbols can be tied to the 45th Infantry Division and its connection to Native Americans who served in the Division.


That being said, after consultation with Clark as well as our curator Mike Gonzales, we believe the story of the coin will sadly remain a mystery, beyond your previous intuition that it was worn by a soldier – perhaps for good luck during the war?


Best

Denise


Denise Neil, Ph.D.

Executive Director, 45th Infantry Division Museum

 

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Thank you @TylerH

As I've said several times, this explanation of the source of the coin is, not only the most likely, but it is also the most plausible.
In the beginning of this search for answers, I leaned towards a Boy Scout, then towards a Native American Boy Scout, but after studying all of the links, and all of the replies, from all of the members and non-members alike, I would have to whole-heartedly agree with the Executive Director of the 45th Infantry Division Museum who holds a Ph.D. in her chosen field and whose qualifications far exceed my own, and every other member of this forum.

I think this information definitely puts this quest to rest. However, my interest has been piqued and I intend to further research the 45th Infantry for my own education.

Thanks again Tyler. You've done an amazing job. Everyone should thank you for your diligence and efforts.

Frank

 

The personal comments about intelligence were superfluous and, in my opinion, rather unnecessary. You should be intelligent enough to know that when you argue, you should leave the personal out of it and focus on the facts and argument at hand. Also, I never confused anything for another. Those were you putting words into my mouth. I simply said there's enough similarities that I would not want to mess with it. Regardless of the symbols on the coin, we still have no way of proving who made then, when they made them, or why they made them. We can only guess.

Also, look at the coin again. That's not a Sauwastika, it's a swastika. If I followed that up with "I'm surprised any normally intelligent person would confuse such obvious things" then I would have intended it as an insult, because it adds nothing to my statement of fact that it's a swastika.

Edit: and the comment about parading swastikas as some form of protest to the Nazis is rather ironic, and I'll leave it at that.

 

Info about the source of the Swastika's use in Germany.

man-who-brought-swastika-germany-and-how-nazis-stole-it-180962812

history-of-the-swastika

This is the only way I could get this one :

• #WTFACT
• HISTORY

How the Symbolism of the Swastika Was Ruined
WRITTEN BY: Jonathan Hogeback
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© Nikhil Gangavane/Dreamstime.com
The earliest known use of the swastika symbol—an equilateral cross with arms bent to the right at 90° angles—was discovered carved on a 15,000-year-old ivory figurine of a bird made from mammoth tusk. The ancient engraving is hypothesized to have been used for fertility and health purposes, the pattern similar to one that is found naturally occurring on the mammoth—an animal that has been regarded as a symbol of fertility.

From its earliest conception, the symbol is believed to have been positive and encouraging of life. The modern name for the icon, derived from the Sanskrit svastika, means “conducive to well-being.” It has been used by cultures around the world for myriad different purposes throughout history: as a symbol in Hinduism, Buddhism, and Jainism; as a stylized cross in Christianity; in ancient Asiatic culture as a pattern in art; in Greek currency; in Medieval, Renaissance, and Baroque architecture; and on Iron Age artifacts. While the symbol has a long history of having a positive connotation, it was forever corrupted by its use in one cultural context: Nazi Germany.


In 1920 Adolf Hitler adopted the swastika as a German national symbol and as the central element in the party flag of the National Socialist Party, or Nazi Party, which rose to power in Germany the following decade. By 1945, the symbol had become associated with World War II, military brutality, fascism, and genocide—spurred by Nazi Germany’s attempted totalitarian conquest of Europe. The icon was chosen by the party to represent its goal of racial purification in Europe. Hitler and his Nazi Party believed that a line of pure Germanic ancestry originating in the Aryan race—a grouping used to describe Indo-European, Germanic, and Nordic peoples—was superior and that other, less-superior races should be ousted from Europe. Ancient Indian artifacts once owned by Aryan nomads were found to frequently feature the swastika, and the symbol was co-opted from its ambiguous historical context in the region to exert the dominance of so-called Aryan heritage.

Since World War II, the swastika has become stigmatized as a symbol of hatred and racial bias. It is used frequently by white-supremacy groups and modern iterations of the Nazi Party. Along with other symbolism employed by the party, the use of the icon has been outlawed in Germany.

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In this next link, please scroll down to the entry covering North America and note the short entry about an American Indian named Moses Neptune, and also the references to the 45th Infantry and it's symbols.

Swastika

Next, a short one :

how-why-sanskrit-symbol-become-nazi-swastika-svastika



Another short one :

how-nazis-twisted-the-swastika-into-a-symbol-of-hate-83020


Another short one :

the-swastikas-origins


If you google " How, when, and why did the Swastika become the Nazi symbol" you will find a total of 190 entries on the subject. The posts above are the first 7 of those entries. There is an enormous wealth of information contained in those links. To anyone interested, please avail yourself of it.

 

I wanted to post a picture of my recent flea market find, and decided to add it at the tail end of this thread on the NAZI SWASTIKA symbol. [I am NOT a neo-nazi sympathizer nor am I a white supremacist; it wasn't politics that prompted this purchase.] Not sure that these are coins though, my guess that they may be copies of medallions. Not sure for certain, so I'll leave that determination in your collective learned hands. [I read on the internet that HITLER did not want his face on German coins until after he had won WWII.]

 

Many cultures have used this symbol (or variants) for centuries: