Last week TIF started a thread on finding a better black background for her coin photography: https://www.cointalk.com/threads/coin-photography-a-blacker-black.349008/ During the course of its run Ed Snible asked about white backgrounds. I resonated to that since I have never been satisfied with my shots of coins against a really shadowless white background. However, in a post by Severus Alexander he drew attention to a light-box tracing pad as a means to getting a white background for numismatic photography, and he provided a link to the "Tikteck" pad. I have tended to default to black backgrounds at least in part because of my trouble getting a good result with white (though I do prefer the black aesthetically anyway), but having worked with a lightbox for my transparencies (back in the day) I surmised that a lightbox might do the trick. So I decided to order one since it was on sale for about $16 shipped. It came and today I did some testing and thought I would share the results for the sake of anyone else on the list who has struggled with this as I have. For a subject coin I chose a rather bright billon antoninianus of Diocletian (silver will be next). For reference I shot this coin against a black background for a range of lens settings f11-f8. I like nicely saturated color balance, so tend to prefer a somewhat darker image. For these I did not do any post editing of the pics. Here is the reference shot (at f11): And here is the camera setup for that: -2 gooseneck lamps with daylight LED bulbs (~5400K) and 20# white paper diffusion screens, set at positions 10 and 2 (appearances in the photo below notwithstanding) -black velvet background on a vertically adjustable stage sitting on a platform of iron plates. -Canon Rebel XLR fitted with a 105mm Nikon Micro-Nikkor lens set out 1 inch from the camera body by a combination of tubes and adapters. The camera rides on a focusing stage attached to an old copystand. This camera setup was not changed, but the staging for the coin was altered to accommodate the placement of the tracing screen directly on the iron plate platform: I powered up the tracing screen and took a shot using the same camera settings as before. At first the results were unacceptable: The coin image was fine, but the background was not uniform. The tracing pad does not have a uniform distribution of light although it appears to be close. As long as the light was steady it seemed one might be able to get a uniform background by staying close to a central spot. When I was careful to flip the coin on the same spot: That one is close enough to be a contender. Going forward I will use a Sharpie to place a small mark on my undersheet of mylar and use it to position my coins for both sides within reasonable limits. I still plan to tweak it to brighten it up against the background, and eliminate as much of the shadowy haze still showing, but now I have hopes that with a bit more tweaking better white background shots are ahead. Thanks for the link to a handy piece of gear, Severus Alexander. Show us your solutions to the white background "problem," especially those that do not require a lot of tweaking in post.
I just edit out the background, like I did with your last photo: For me, its not how to get the end result, but how to get a good enough shot to begin with (which I am always struggling with). And edited for color/contrast: Looks about the same as your black background.
I dont have Photoshop. Instead I use the 'poor mans' method. I use Powerpoint. In either Powerpoint or Word, you can drag a photo onto a blank page, then under "Format Picture" there is a button for "Remove Background". Its very easy, but the better your photo the better the results:
Generally speaking, shooting on white backgrounds is more difficult than shooting against black. The trick to get a perfect white background out of camera is overexposure of the background and generous distance between the subject and the background. The white background will reflect light on your subject, but you can absorb and or block some of that light with strategically placed black panels (foam core works great).
The problem that has defeated me when trying to shoot on white is that shooting into the background light creates a little flare which softens the contrasts in the image in a way that can not be compensated fully in postprocessing. It is like the problem we had back when some camera lenses were not coated. I dislike white backgrounds enough that I lost interest in trying to overcome the problem.
I'm glad the suggestion was helpful! I never managed to solve the problem Doug identifies, though a ring light around the lens seems to help a bit for some reason. @jb_depew, I'm sure we'd all appreciate a few more details about where to place those black panels! Keynote for Mac has a similar "instant alpha" function that works very well (Format > Image menu). Normally I just use partial metering and adjust the white point though, then I get a plain white background.
I'm still using Powerpoint 2007 for PC, and it apparently doesn't have the same features as your version for Mac (what version is that?). Does anyone know if any version of Powerpoint or Word for PC has the features Ken describes? Since everything 2007 for Windows won't be supported going into next year, I'm about due for a change. But all that aside, don't you feel that the tracing screen does a good job with back illumination? Those pics are without any post editing. Of course, they can be tweaked. Here's an edit of my last shot with a bit higher luminence level (but not adjusted for contrast): But I wanted to show what it could do without editing. The point is that a publishable result is doable, I think. Or am I deluding myself? What would you like to see different about this pic?
I get a kick out of Ken calling Word/Powerpoint the 'poor mans' alternative. I refuse to have anything to do with Office 365 leasing so switched to Open Office which is free but requires learning a few differences. It does what I need in word processing and spreadsheets but I have not looked into using it for this purpose. There is no reason to buy full Photoshop for coin editing. I use Photoshop Elements but that is mostly because I am used to it and too lazy to switch brands. I have a perceived need for a program that will allow working in 16 bit until the final conversion to JPG for my non coin shots but that rarely is important on coins where lighting is controlled. Elements does 16 bit but not all do. I do RAW conversion using Canon DPP 4 which is free with the camera (you download but have to provide the serial number of the camera). This thread reminded me I had not downloaded the latest version for a while so I did that yesterday. I recommend Canon software for Canon users but that program does not allow manipulations like combining frames or cropping. It is wholly for tone/density adjustment.
To remove a background, or add it, I use www.remove.bg (I have no conflict of interest). It's super easy, you just drag, or upload your file, and the background is removed automatically. Here is your photo 1 on a transparent background:
just tested this its pretty nice, I use a program called gimp to edit mine, I'll probably use this from now on to remove the backgrounds so much easier thanks
I tried remove.bg but found it worked no better than what I could do with Photoshop Elements. Like Doug, I've been using it for more than a decade and that's the main reason I don't switch to some other photo editing program. However, I might be forced to switch soon. PSE is getting buggier as Adobe pushes everyone towards a subscription service. I do not want another monthly bill... which is another reason I'm not going to use remove.bg. If I'm going to pay for a photo editor it needs be more than a one trick pony. I don't think that is a satisfactory result. There is a rind of black remaining in several places and the returned image is smaller than the submitted image, although with a paid subscription you can receive an original size image.
These are some good solutions, both photographically and technically. If you are getting lens flare using a white background, move the angle of your lights a little and see if it goes away. Putting some distance between the light source and the diffuser can help also, it softens the light source more. Tracing velum (white tracing paper) makes a good diffuser as well as a background on top of a lightbox.
I suspect you agree that how well the background remover works is directly related to the quality of the original photograph. If the coin edges are distinctly seen in the original photo, the background removal will be effective. If the edges and obscured by shadow, blend into the background, or are poorly focused, it won't work well. In other words, the same factors that make it simple or difficult to remove the background with any photo editing program, free or paid, hold true.
Before you start your shoot make sure you set your white balance. It really is important for consistency in your shoot. You only need to do it once each session. Follow the menu to find how do do it on your camera for slr's. Another hint, make sure you get as much image as you can in the view finder. This way you have very little background to deal with and get all you can of your subject. This very important as you want a photo of your coin rather than background and saves you time in the cropping of your coin. Cheers and good luck.
