A New Style Athenian Tetradrachm for the top shelf

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Nvb, Sep 8, 2019.

  1. Nvb

    Nvb Well-Known Member

    My Classical owl was lonely, so I got her a friend!
    She is no more or less wise than her older counterpart, but does have a few hundred years more history to reflect upon.
    While she isnt as iconic or powerful as her predecessor, she is just as refined, elegant and worthy in every way.

    This is my first purchase from Harlan Berk. The short videos are IMO a wonderful way to showcase the coin as it looks in hand. It certainly helped me feel confident about my purchase. I LOVE the deep strike and sharpness of detail, particularly the Athena's headdress. This is what I was looking for in a new style Tetradrachm above all other things, so was willing to live with the slight lack of toning - that should come back in time after all =)




    (Mods, did I do that right? I do not want to infringe on copyrights)

    Attica, Athens, New Style; Magistrates Mened- and Epigeno-, Asklepios, c. 135/4 BC, Tetradrachm, 16.90g. Thompson-353, rev. like a which equals 352b, but neither of these coins is illustrated. Obv: Helmeted head of Athena r. Rx: Owl standing r. on amphora, head front; ethnic and magistrates' names l. and r., in l. field Asklepios standing l., leaning on serpent staff; third magistrate EΠIΓO in r. field (final O impinges on wreath), Z on amphora (written like sideways H), ME below; all within olive wreath. Right obverse field and cheek of Athena strongly cleaned. EF

    I really do think the New Style tets are an underrated type with a huge number of variations and nuances to choose from. Post them if you've got them, or feel free to add any cultural or educational context to this issue of coins that ran from 164BC to 40BC
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2019
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  3. Volodya

    Volodya Junior Member

    I'll put on my HJB cap for a moment and firmly promise on behalf of the firm that you won't be hearing from our lawyers!

    Phil Davis
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2019
  4. Ed Snible

    Ed Snible Well-Known Member

    The interesting thing about these coins is that they can be dated to the month.

    image00052.jpg
    ATTICA, Athens, Tetradrachm (16.5g), June 13 - July 13, 97 BC. New Style coinage. 27mm
    Obv: Head of Athena right, wearing crested Attic helmet
    Rev: AΘ-E / NI-KH-THΣ, ΔIO-NY-ΣIOΣ, EMΒI (=Athens, Niketes, Dionysios, and Embi-) Owl standing right, head facing, on amphora; magistrates’ names in fields; gorgoneion to right; M (= month 12) on amphora, MH below; all within wreath.
    Ref: Thompson 961 (Seems to match the obverse die for Thompson 961, reverse die of 958a)

    The dating for coins with the Medusa symbol is usually given as 98/97 BC. This one has the month M which is the last month of the Athenian year. The coins use a lunar calendar (there is an occasional N for month 13) but there was no N in 97 BC.

    According to http://astropixels.com/ephemeris/phasescat/phases-0099.html, the moon was new on Jun 13, 97 BC and on Jul 13, 97 BC. So the dies were made for coins to be struck during those days.
     
  5. Nvb

    Nvb Well-Known Member

    @Ed Snible
    Fantastic coin with a ton of character, I dont think I had seen a reverse with Medusa!
    That's some great info on the dating too, much apprecated.
     
    jamesicus likes this.
  6. Jwt708

    Jwt708 Well-Known Member

    Love your coin @Nvb ! The video is neat too, really let's me see the relief.
     
    Nvb likes this.
  7. Sallent

    Sallent Live long and prosper

    Sweet coins. That video really makes those coins look very attractive. I've ignored them for a long time but after watching that video I might have to put one in my future buy list.
     
    Nvb likes this.
  8. Silverlock

    Silverlock Well-Known Member

    This is brilliant. I’ve been sat next to a new style tet (upper right AR in my avatar) this past year, and never knew it was minted in:

    Hekatombaion (Ἑκατομβαιών) July/August

    Thanks!
     
    Paul M. and Nvb like this.
  9. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    So, if I read the Athenian calendar correctly, then the Gamma on my coin would be January-February? But which year? 127-26 BC?
    Athens Attica B.jpg
    ATHENS ATTICA
    AR Tetradrachm
    OBVERSE: Helmeted head of Athena right
    REVERSE: Owl standing right, head facing, on overturned amphora; to left, eagle standing right on thunderbolt; Gamma on amphora, ΗΡΑ in exergue; all within laurel wreath
    Struck at Athens Epigene-, Sosandros and Eume(nes)-, magistrates 127/26 BC
    16.8g, 30mm
    Thompson 477a
     
  10. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Wow! What a gorgeous example!
     
    Nvb likes this.
  11. Orfew

    Orfew Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus

    Wow, what a fantastic example @Nvb
     
    Nvb likes this.
  12. Andres2

    Andres2 Well-Known Member

    High quality Owl, congrats Nvb

    Here's mine:

    P1230030b.jpg
     
    Carl Wilmont, Paul M., Nvb and 2 others like this.
  13. Ed Snible

    Ed Snible Well-Known Member

    Look up the eagle-on-thunderbolt symbol in Thompson or Mørkholm. I have neither, but luckily there are many examples on the web for Thompson 477 reading 126/25 BC or 125/24 BC.

    https://www.cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=272539
    https://www.cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=271386

    Your coin has a Gamma, which is 3 in Greek Numerals. That should be the third month, Boedromion, September/October. Meaning the earlier year. I am uncertain if this means the earlier year of 126/5 or 125/4, or some other year, lacking Thompson and Mørkholm references.
     
    Carl Wilmont, Paul M. and Nvb like this.
  14. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    This is the Athenian calendar I looked at. If the Gamma represents Gamelion then the months would be January/February. Right?
    a1af7b94b022fbb1956ee3b566e817d7efe9cf92_hq__1568032579_47.198.243.248a.jpg
     
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  15. Ed Snible

    Ed Snible Well-Known Member

    New Style coins have numerals Α-Μ (or even Ν in intercalary years, when there were thirteen lunar months). These are numbers, not abbreviations for month names.

    There are three months beginning with M, so abbreviations would not be useful.

    Gamma means "3rd month", Bodromion, not the month beginning with G.
     
  16. Silverlock

    Silverlock Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the references. The Thompson book is available online here:

    http://numismatics.org/digitallibrary/ark:/53695/nnan131509
     
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  17. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    Thanks for the clarification.
     
  18. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    That is a beautiful coin. For those without such wonderfully high grade coins, it might be good to warn that the numeral on the amphora is the high point on the reverse and worn off many coins of the type even though these are regularly well struck and centered with full legends and clear minor devices.
    g41320bb0360.jpg

    Of course there are worse things from a coin's standpoint than a little wear. Ask this fourree. The delta on the amphora is weakly present but being cut in half revealing a copper core is much worse.
    g41335fd2800a.jpg
     
  19. akeady

    akeady Well-Known Member

    Nice coins - here's mine - not much wear, but a flat strike.

    Wt./Size/Axis: 16.75g / 32.5mm / 12h
    References:
    • Sv. 13 pl. 37
    • NSSCA. 66 b pl. 9
    Provenances:
    • CGB
    • Ex. CGB Monnaies XI, 21st Jan 2002, no. 93
    Acquisition/Sale: VSO 23 #86 27/11/2004

    [​IMG]

    This luckily survived a burglary shortly after I got it (she now lives in a Safety Deposit Box).
     
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  20. Nvb

    Nvb Well-Known Member

    @dougsmit I have never seen a halved fouree. Interesting how the silver is paper thin on the reverse while on the obverse it's almost as thick as the bronze itself ..
     
  21. Paul M.

    Paul M. Well-Known Member

    Wow, great coins and great info, everyone! Mine isn’t quite as well preserved as @Nvb’s, but I like it:
    048DE39A-0EDE-4133-AB59-1124F179101B.jpeg
    I think the numeral is theta (5), so that would mean it was struck in October or November, right?
     
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