An extremely rare Septimius Severus denarius?

I recently bought a large lot of Roman denarii, and I have been attributing them to prep them for sale. Then I got to this one. The obverse reads SEVERVS PIVS AVG and the reverse reads PROVID AVGG. I searched Wildwinds and could not find it. I searched ACSearch and could not find it. Then I searched OCRE and finally found the attribution: RIC IV 284. And that example was a scudzy coin from a museum collection. So how rare is this coin? @dougsmit

http://numismatics.org/ocre/id/ric.4.ss.284

My coin:



The museum’s coin:

 

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The reverse is common but not paired with the SEVERVS PIVS AVG obverse. The museum coin lookss to be fourree and unofficial but yours looks solid. I don't try to keep up with Rome mint after the first couple years so I don't know how rare this is but I have not seen it. I'd call it a good find. Mine is normal with the PART MAX obverse.

 

Nice find!

 

Nice find! The British Museum does not have an example in their collection, either.

 

Lost? They should have it. RIC gives the BM as source.


P.S.: Don't believe the RIC rarity.

 

They should, but they don't. A search for "Septimius PROVID AVGG" only yields PART MAX examples.

And a search for "Septimius 284" doesn't find it, either.

 

I don’t have RIC, and I have seen no references to how rare it is. I’m just asking because I simply don’t see any other than the museum piece.

 

very nice

 

I just checked a split on the edge. I think I see a bronze core beneath it. It weighs 2.98g. I think I will keep this one in my collection. I love contemporary counterfeits.

 

It’s really weird because the luster/toning/style/lack of corrosion/verdigris makes it look like an absolutely-genuine piece.

 

Here's My PROVID.AVGG

 

I just compared what I saw with what I see in the edge splits of other Septimius Severus denarii I have, and it was a match. It seems far more likely that this was a legitimate mint product.

@dougsmit I am going to test the metallic composition tomorrow with a Sigma. What silver purity should I check for? A quick search suggests 56/57%.

 

I don't know and do not put much stock in surface readings due to surface enrichment possibilities. he only way to know for sure if the coin is plated would destroy it. I don't think it is plated but that does not mean much either. Finding a die link to either side would be quite interesting but I don't know anyone really deep into later period SS and don't know whom to ask.

 

An XRF reads just the surface. The Sigma analyzes the entire coin.

 

https://www.sigmametalytics.com/old-pages/faq-s.html
This one?

 

I would be hesitant to use a Sigma on ancient coins. The resistivity measurement is influenced by the alloying metal as well as the internal structure (voids, porosity, incomplete alloying, etc). You can ignore these variables for modern coins as the process for making the blanks is uniform. But for ancients...? Cast blanks with who knows what else is in the mix. Not something for an accurate resistivity measurement.

Not sure if you're still in school or finally working in the aerospace industry. If I had easy access to an SEM, I'd get a couple of EDS spectra of the surface and some areas that are cracked. MAYBE you could pick up some differences that would indicate a base metal core.

 

Congrats on the rarity! Here's my more common variety.

Septimius Severus, AR Denarius, Rome, AD 200-201
Obv: SEVERVS AVG PART MAX, laureate head right
Rev: PROVID AVGG, Providentia standing left, holding wand over globe and sceptre
Ref: RIC IV 166

 

The sigma only measured down to 80% silver, so it was useless, even if the flans were uniform.

I used my LCS’ microscope, and I saw that the metal in the split was uniform with the surface metal, meaning that the core of the coin is also silver. I now strongly believe that this coin is an official issue.

 

It's definitely rare. I've only come across one: http://www.coryssa.org/246008

And XRF is a perfectly capable process to determine alloy content on a Severan coin. The surface-core differences are absolutely trivial.

Rasiel

 

Given the rarity of this pairing of obverse and reverse for Sep Sev, dare we suggest that it is a hybrid, muling design types designated for the same ruler but not intended to be together? Or is that so obvious it didn't need to be said?

If so, we cannot rule out that it was unofficially produced in good silver. Or can we?