Do you see two varieties here?

Discussion in 'World Coins' started by mlov43, Jul 21, 2019.

  1. mlov43

    mlov43 주화 수집가

    Here is a photo of two South Korean 1969-dated Five-Won coins.
    Screen Shot 2019-07-21 at 5.36.22 PM.png
    When showing these two dates to officials at the Korean Mint, they doubted that there are two varieties in the photos, but was just a trick of the light. I should have showed them THIS photo below, a closer view and some graphics I added that help the eye see how the numerals line up to the word, "KOREA" above the dates.

    Screen Shot 2019-07-13 at 4.59.07 PM.png

    Do you also see some doubling going on with the date on the left?

    According to the Korean Mint's own internal histories, the first year that they began pressing their own working dies was in 1969.

    I just want to make sure that I'm not the only one who sees this.
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2019
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  3. paddyman98

    paddyman98 I'm a professional expert in specializing! Supporter

    So would that be called the shifted date variety?
     
  4. paddyman98

    paddyman98 I'm a professional expert in specializing! Supporter

    One Won or Five Won?
     
  5. mlov43

    mlov43 주화 수집가

    Well, I suppose getting the numismatic terminology correct would be nice. Is that it?
     
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  6. mlov43

    mlov43 주화 수집가

    Five.

    Thanks for the catch!
     
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  7. alurid

    alurid Well-Known Member

    The date on the right has smaller gaps between it's numbers.
     
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  8. Stork

    Stork I deliver Supporter

    Also looks like (again could be the light) the '1's have a different serif or lack thereof.
     
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  9. Jaelus

    Jaelus The Hungarian Antiquarian Supporter

    The date spacing definitely appears different. I counted the dentils in both for comparison (just in case there was a discrepancy), and they each have 83.
     
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  10. mlov43

    mlov43 주화 수집가

    ...You counted the dentils (or is it denticles? I don't know...) You, Sir, are a class act!
    original_46.png
     
  11. mlov43

    mlov43 주화 수집가

    Last edited: Jul 22, 2019
  12. Jaelus

    Jaelus The Hungarian Antiquarian Supporter

    Either is correct. They mean the same thing.

    Count your dentils and you'll be surprised sometimes. Just because the number is the same, doesn't mean the dies are the same, but sometimes you see a slightly different count (off by 1 or 2), and it can be an irrefutable way to demonstrate the use of a different die.
     
  13. TheGame

    TheGame Well-Known Member

    I would go with wide and narrow date for the two varieties. Is it me, or is there a difference in the size of the digits between the two as well?
     
  14. Burton Strauss III

    Burton Strauss III Brother can you spare a trime? Supporter

    Do you know whether the Korean Mint applied dates to the hub or the working dies and if it was done by hand?

    Hand-applied dates/mintmarks are rarely called varieties - that would indicate different sets of punches were used.
     
  15. mlov43

    mlov43 주화 수집가

    Darn good question!
    I'm guessing that the dates were applied by hand in the case of the one on the left. They might have asked the Osaka (Japan) Mint or the medallist firm, John Pinches in London to make the one on the right, and when that one shattered (or something) they applied the date to a "spare" hub (coin on the left) by hand. Both of those mints (Osaka, John Pinches) are cited in their histories as the only sources of their master dies for their circulation coins up to 1982.

    Well, this is something I should ask my contacts...but neither of them were around at that time. All of the people involved are all almost certainly dead, or impossible to contact. I just found out last month that the author of the only book on South Korean coins (and former Korean Mint designer since 1965) died about five years ago.


    I only notice a difference in the serifs with the "1"s. The "6"s are different, too. This does make me think that at least the date on the left was applied by hand.
     
  16. TuckHard

    TuckHard Well-Known Member

    Great research on this guys. Love finding new varieties!
     
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