Hi Just decided to join up as I need some advice on Spanish Colonial coins. Particularly pillar and wave Peruvian minted 8 reales from the reign of Charles II. I am considering buying one from the end of the 17th century. I have checked it is the right weight, and the right size, and it looks like all the others I've been able to find pictures of. Now the seller says it was recovered from a wreck and bought at auction by a now deceased relative. But I am suspicious as its exceptionally good grade and he has no certification for it. The seller seems genuine and I believe is really convinced it is a real piece of eight. But I am wondering how on earth I can tell if its genuine or a copy? He is asking slightly below what many American coin dealers are for something similar but much poorer grade. Cheers John
Pictures would be really helpful. Wreck coins normally have eroded surfaces from the water, so are much cheaper than others. Is the date off ?? Is the mint off ? If it is, then it is understandable.
We have one major problem here - the Lima mint was ordered closed by Royal Decree on April 10th, 1660. It did not re-open until December of 1683. That being said, what you have here looks like an 8 reales from Potosi, the mint in Bolivia. But there are a few problems - the most glaring of them being that whoever made the coin kind of made a whoops, the date on the obverse says 676, the date on the reverse says 76. Now I know of no variety like this, but I have several books I have to go through to make sure. So right off, I think the coin is a fake. But I'll do the research and get back to you.
Hi Sorry that was my mistake I knew it was Potosi mint but for some reason got mixed up and thought that was Peru but you are right it is Bolivia. It sold to a collector of Spanish Collonial coins (Not me!) for UK £156 (about US $311). Is this a lot of money for a possible fake? Would still be interested on your opinion on it still. Also would be interested to know if its possible to get pillar and wave cobs like this is such good condition? All the ones I've seen have come out the sea and are in poor condition. Cheers John
As for the condition, the coin is supposed to represent what is known as a Royal, or a Presentation Cob. They were struck with great care for almost all years from specially prepared dies and planchets. But nothing I can find explains the few design differences this coin has from other known examples. As I mentioned earlier, the most obvious of these is the date on the obverse - there should only be 2 numbers there, and there are 3. Given that, I still have my suspicions that the coin is a fake. Only an in hand examination by an expert in these coins would convince me otherwise.
Hi Noticed this on ebay - http://cgi.ebay.com/1668-Potosi-8-R...ZWD1VQQ_trksidZp1638.m118.l1247QQcmdZViewItem This is another 8 reales cob coin from Potosi. This one also has the 2 number date on one side and a 3 number date on the other. Hummm...
I am no expert on these for sure, but I will say fake/cast, on your original pics of the first one, notice the area to the right of SVL in the center, there appears to be a metal ball on the surface (this is caused by air bubbles in the casting investment) The same thing with the Rim area to the south of the cross, and the area between the 1 and 6 on the Rim date.....JMO
Yes it does. The point is though, that it was in 1676 that the 2 digit date started. In prior years, the 3 digit date on one side was the norm.
It must definitely be a fake then. Just goes to prove the usefulness of a forum like this where you can get good advice and save your self getting tucked up a treat.
The guy reckons he has another one of these for sale. I've asked for pictures. I might get one purely as a talking point. Just what is a fake one worth?
If it's fake, and I suspect it is because these coins are quite rare and for someone to just happen to have 2 of them - well, you get the idea - then if it had any value at all it would be based the value of the silver only, assuming there was any silver at all. So a few dollars at best.
