When you need a lil' Jesus (Cross AE4 pile on thread)

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Finn235, May 23, 2019.

  1. Finn235

    Finn235 Well-Known Member

    The tiny crosses of the terminal empire were one of the first series of ancient coins that really gripped me. Up until recently, I kept every one I came across, but recently made the tough decision to prune it back to just my favorites.

    Maybe it's the elegant simplicity; maybe it's the thrill of *maybe* finding a Galla Placidia, but I still love them.

    So post em if you got em!

    Arcadius, CONCORDIA AVGGG, Kyzikos mint
    imgonline-com-ua-twotoone-vxomD9sg6K.jpg

    Theodosius II, Anepigraphic cross in wreath, Antioch mint - I love the unusual bust style on this one!
    Theodosius ii cross wreath ANT D.jpg

    I have a few more imperial issues, but apparently not imaged. I'll work on that....

    While uncommon, the barbarians did produce imitations of these. Some are probably impossible to distinguish from the originals, but others are unmistakable

    This one is highly unusual for attempting to copy the CONCORDIA AVGGG reverse. All that's visible is -VO-
    imgonline-com-ua-twotoone-ldYRoC1gH0YgUXkb.jpg

    And you think Aurelian had a big neck!
    Barbarous ae4 theodosius ii cross giraffe neck.jpg

    Another fun one of bizarre style, legend of all I's imgonline-com-ua-twotoone-3UEyPdquEOtHpuK.jpg

    Nearly a century later, the Vandals in Africa saw fit to copy these coins under their king Hilderic (523-530), who incidentally was the grandson of Valentinian III and great-grandson of Theodosius II

    Vandals Hilderic nummus cross.jpg
    Hilderic rex nummus.jpg

    Who else has some? Let's see some cross coins!
     
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  3. furryfrog02

    furryfrog02 Well-Known Member

    I have a couple that I was never able to ID. When I get home I will see if I can find them and post them.
     
  4. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter 3rd Century Usurper

    I think I've got a couple photographed - let me check my coin photos file.
     
  5. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter 3rd Century Usurper

    Couldn't find the cross one in my photos, so for now here is one I have photographed of a camp gate.

    arcadius5.jpg
     
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  6. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    [​IMG]
    Theodosius II (402 - 450 A.D.)
    Æ4
    O: D N THEODO-SIVS P F AVG, diademed, draped and cuirassed bust right.
    R: cross in wreath, SMKB in exergue.
    Cyzicus Mint
    1g
    13mm
    RIC X 44
     
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  7. David@PCC

    David@PCC allcoinage.com

    Out of the many dozens I came across in uncleaned lots, most were attributable. I believe this is the only one I have left.
    ri185.jpg
    Honorius
    404 to 406 AD
    AE 4
    Obvs: (DN H)ONORI(VS PF AVG), Diademed right.
    Revs: (CON)COR DI(A AVGGG), Cross
    10x11mm, 0.7g
     
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  8. Justin Lee

    Justin Lee I learn by doing

    I've got this lil guy, that when I last posted about it trying to ID it, ended up thinking it was maybe an imitation of a Vandal cross with the IIIII's around the cross and odd/interesting obv bust left(?).
    [​IMG]
    10-11mm, 0.65g

    Or does anyone have any more enlightening ideas? :)
     
  9. philologus_1

    philologus_1 Supporter! Supporter

    Theodosius II, Alexandria:
    upload_2019-5-23_9-44-20.png

    Theodosius II, Antioch, cross on shield:
    upload_2019-5-23_9-46-54.png

    Honorius, Heraclea:
    upload_2019-5-23_9-52-56.png

    Honorius, Cyzicus:
    upload_2019-5-23_9-57-50.png

    Vandals under Gaiseric or Huneric:
    upload_2019-5-23_10-6-20.png
     

    Attached Files:

  10. ValiantKnight

    ValiantKnight Well-Known Member

    Galla Placidia, Western Roman Empire
    AE nummus
    Obv: D N GALLA PLA-CIDIA P F AVG, female, pearl-diademed bust right, wearing necklace and earrings
    Rev: SALVS REI-PVBLICE around cross, T in left field
    Mint: Rome
    Mintmark: RM
    Date: 425-437 AD
    Ref: RIC X 2111

    [​IMG]
     
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  11. gsimonel

    gsimonel Well-Known Member

    I'm curious how you can distinguish the Vandalic issues from the 5th century Roman issues. I even bought a copy of Wroth, "Vandals" as a reference, but I still can't tell them apart. Can anyone enlighten me?
     
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  12. philologus_1

    philologus_1 Supporter! Supporter

    I'm also desirous of enlightenment. In this late-Roman/Vandalic/pre-Byzantine era of numismatics I rely almost totally on seller's attributions. :sorry:
     
  13. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    RI Theodosius II 402-450 CE AE4 11mm Cross in Wreath.jpg
    RI Theodosius II 402-450 CE AE4 11mm Cross in Wreath
     
  14. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    I guess we could call my Cyzicus Theodosius II a bit ragged on the edge.
    ry8092bb3085.jpg
     
  15. philologus_1

    philologus_1 Supporter! Supporter

    Ragged indeed! It *almost* looks like the intentionally serrated flans of some Seleucid types. Regardless... it has great character, and the reverse alone makes it a "keeper" in my book.
     
  16. Finn235

    Finn235 Well-Known Member

    I have my suspicions that "vandals" is just a buzzword used to boost the price of regular old imitations of this type. I only feel confident about mine because they came in a CNG lot where all the coins had the same patina and about 20% of the lot were types only made by the Vandals while the rest were coins the Vandals would have had access to (mostly Marcian/Leo/Zeno monograms). The Vandal crosses I have seen usually have a bold cross potent inside a very thick wreath, and the drapery on the bust is usually of a fairly distinct style.

    That being said, neither of the two I posted in the OP have the legend "HILD REX" so maybe even I jumped the gun on the ID?
     
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  17. philologus_1

    philologus_1 Supporter! Supporter

    Speaking of ancient Roman coins with a Cross: See attached for my 26 different examples of Valentinian II SALVS REIPVLICAE AE4's which include various shapes/forms of a Cross.

    I have another 51 examples of the same emperor's SALVS REIPVBLICAE AE4 types which each include a form of Tau-Rho rather than a Cross. But those are for another day and another thread.

    I picked one emperor so as to gather various shapes/forms of Christian emblems across the Roman Empire in one relatively short time span, (375-392 A.D.). Not surprisingly there is quite a variety! It appears that despite the plethora of Cross and Tau-Rho varieties, none of this emperor's SALVS coins were produced with a true Chi-Rho. This despite the fact that a Chi-Rho appears as early as 327 AD.
     

    Attached Files:

  18. seth77

    seth77 Well-Known Member

    Or maybe a Bonifatius as Comes Africae.
     
  19. Severus Alexander

    Severus Alexander find me at NumisForums

    Theodosius II, issued 402-408, not sure of the mint (Nicomedia, Heracleia, or Cyzicus).

    Screen Shot 2019-05-24 at 4.26.49 PM.jpg
     
  20. Clavdivs

    Clavdivs Well-Known Member

    "Priestly" Implements... sorry someone has to stand up for the Pagans!!

    Aurelius4_MERGE.jpg
    Marcus Aurelius. As Caesar, AD 139-161. Æ As (25mm, 13.60 g, 12h). Rome mint. Struck under Antoninus Pius, AD 140-144. Bare head right / Implements of the augurate and pontificate: secespita, aspergillum, guttus, lituus, and simpulum. RIC III 1240a (Pius)
     
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  21. BusterLuke

    BusterLuke New Member

    I can't identify the emp, the coin is so tiny. But it's a crucifix, in a wreath
     

    Attached Files:

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