AU with Scratches?

What about the value of an "improperly cleaned" high relief St-Gaudens? Here's one, for example: https://www.ebay.com/itm/1907-20-Go...lief-Unc-Details-PCGS-Wire-Edge-/233206626031

 

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That one has been polished on its highest design points. Note the bright color on Ms. Liberty’s chest and the high points of the compared to the first coin I posted.

As to price, it was fair years ago, but I don’t know about the current, lower market. I don’t know about that now. The one negative about “details” coins is that you don’t get to participate in the prices increases fully when they occur.

 

So is it possible to "properly" clean a coin --- other than just washing it in soap and water, which I assume is OK?

 

The term “cleaning” implies that the metal on the surface of a coin has been moved. This includes polishing, which has been done to a light extent here, surface hairlines, which a small thin scratches and whizzing, which going of the piece with a fine wire brush. Whizzing creates a false luster which bears a resemblance to mint luster.

Mint luster is created when the coin is struck. The metal flows during instant the coin is made. It creates a surface that plays with the light when an Uncirculated or choice AU is swirled under a light. It can be something like a “cartwheel.” On mint luster is disturbed on a coin, it cannot be restored.

It’s okay to remove dirt and the like from a coin, but you must take care not to disturb the underlying surface. You must also make sure that whatever agent you might have used in the removal process is rinsed off completely.

 

I’d not even look at a coin with a price tag of $500+ unless it’s in a slab and it received a straight grade. Do I buy the label/holder? No, I look at the coin, but it has to be problem-free and it has to have a min. grade of VF30/35.

 

I would never clean a coin, but there is a way to properly preserve some coins.

It would be nice if you had a trusted local dealer that would help and explain things to you while showing you examples. My local shop has done this for me. Sometimes paying a little extra is worth it if you have a dealer you trust - even on line.

And just because a coin is in a holder with a little green bean does not make it perfect. Grading companies and CAC can make mistakes. Raw coins are nice, but there are some I would never buy not in a holder. And for HA it would depend on what you are looking for - you can save money at times versus buying from a dealer.

 

To update everyone on dealing with APMEX about my St G $20, they are not charging any restocking fee for a complete refund (by check since I paid by check). It probably helped that I had earlier ordered a slabbed 1908 St-G No Motto BU from them to replace it. Now that I have already ordered the BU replacement, what is the Prospector BU slab? It know about PCGS and NGC, but I also see Prospector all over the place. Just another grading place?

 

"Prospector" appears to be a grading arm of PCGS. It's one more way to market their product. It appears that they only use words like "Brilliant Uncirculated" without any grading numbers. That works to you disadvantage because when it comes times to sell, the coin does not have a numerical grade on it that is generally accepted in the market.

From what I gather on the PCGS site, common date St. Gaudens $20 gold coins in MS-63 and lower are currently a drug on the market. Dealers are paying less than melt for them and selling them for just over melt.

If the market were to turn and MS-60 to 63 Saints were to reclaim their numismatic value, you will have to get these coins re-graded to get the money out of them.
“Prospector” looks like a marketing tool for PCGS to sell mostly to non-collectors. The emphasis seems to be on bullion and certifying that the coin is genuine. Detailed grading is taking a back seat.

I could be all wrong here, but that is my take.

 

I have been able to nicely clean numerous coins with a very simple cheap method. As for cleaning I only mean removal of common dirt and or debris. Said coins are put into a coffee cup with as hot a temp water that comes out of your sink along with a good squeeze of dish-soap. I prefer "DAWN" because of it's history cleaning the animal victims of various oil spills. I jiggle the cup around for a while until the temp has come down to room temp. I then rinse everything by simply filling/pouring out fresh water from the cup. The coins are taken from the cup to be held under the steam arm of my cheap but reliable espresso maker. ... Voila ... clean coins.

 

...rubbing the coin around the bottom of the cup, right? I'm not sure this is a great idea, especially with mint-state coins...

 

Oh yeah ... good point. I find just so many MS coins with dirt and debris that need cleaning. I should just dump my idea/style right now. To think of all the MS coins that I may have ruined with this foolish idea.

 

The thread's been discussing AU and MS coins.

Sliding a coin around on a hard surface, especially in the presence of grit that was on the coin, is likely to produce fresh scuffs and scratches. At what grade level do you want to start putting new marks on a coin? Especially nice, shiny ones that don't match the rest of the coin's surface?

 

What are really the odds that you are finding all these "Especially nice, shiny [coins] ..." that really are full of dirt and debris? Try maybe realizing and comparing apples to apples instead of including oranges. On top of that ... if you have worries about the bottom of the cup inducing scratches ... put a paper napkin in first.

 

This is .person that should never attempt any sort of restoration process.
All said by ole Zeppo is what is referred to as a cleaning. Do not do any of this. Ever. As said before in this thread their are many a post of proper restoration.

 

OK ... if I were you I’d lose the attitude and stop edited. Maybe get along and realize that everyone thinking differently than you is not always wrong.

 

You can take it however you want. I may have been busting but your method will easily ruin an otherwise nice coin. Your process is definitely on the border of what is called a harsh cleaning.
I may have picked a little but it got your attention.
It would behoove you to read up more on proper cleaning and restoration, in doing so you won't be destroying the numismatic value on a coin.

 

Heritage Auctions

 

Reverse is back of coin & grafitti is someone deliberately scratching or marking the coin. perhaps his/her initials. Google PCGS or NGC ratings & their meanings. Very helpful