Help with luster on my NEWP and GTG

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Michael Scarn, May 5, 2019.

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  1. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    I'm giving you a best answer. Wanna know with a 1word answer. Would you call it frosty or satin. Put it out there for us
     
    Cheech9712, May 8, 2019
    #21 + Quote Reply
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  3. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    Cheech9712, May 8, 2019
    #22 + Quote Reply
  4. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    Cheech9712, May 8, 2019
    #23 + Quote Reply
  5. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    If your not a pro grader. Then those coins are 66's. If your coins were 66+ would you say the same thing.
     
    Cheech9712, May 8, 2019
    #24 + Quote Reply
  6. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    My bad. But that is a very nice quarter. Wish it got a 67
     
    Cheech9712, May 8, 2019
    #25 + Quote Reply
  7. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    Didn't miss by much
     
    Cheech9712, May 8, 2019
    #26 + Quote Reply
  8. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Personally, I'd call it frosty without a moment's hesitation.
     
    GDJMSP, May 9, 2019
    #27 + Quote Reply
    Bob Evancho and Cheech9712 like this.
  9. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    Thanks for your honest answer.
     
    Cheech9712, May 9, 2019
    #28 + Quote Reply
  10. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Well, I think that's a large part of what I tried to explain in my first response. So how to understand it ? If I tried to describe it, it would go something like this.

    Think of a cameo Proof, they are described as having frosted devices and mirrored fields. But why do you think they chose to use the word "frosted" in regard to the devices ? It's because that's how they look, like they have been covered with frost. The very same kind of frost that you see on your car windshield or your lawn on a cold fall morning. In other words, the devices on a cameo Proof look like they have been covered with ice crystals - same as your windshield or lawn.

    Now on Proofs, only the raised devices are frosted. But on business strikes the entire coin sometimes has a very similar look or appearance, the devices and the fields both have a frosty appearance. It's not exactly the same as the frosted devices of a Proof, but as I said it is similar.

    To help with understanding, do a simple exercise. Go to Heritage, access the Auction Archives, and in the Key Word box type in "frosty" and hit your Enter key. This is what will come up -
    https://coins.ha.com/c/search-resul...k=SI_Titles-Desc&Nty=1&Ntt=frosty&limitTo=all

    With every one of those coins they used the word frosty to describe the luster on the coin. And they are all similar in that look to the OP's coin in this thread.

    A satin luster or a satiny coin has a different look. And just like frosty was chosen to describe one look, satiny was chosen to describe another. And it was chosen for similar reasons, because that look is similar to that of satin, the material, just as fall frost was chosen for the other.

    To see what that looks like, and how it differs from frosty simply perform the same exercise on Heritage, only this time use satin and/or satiny as your key word. This is what that brings up -
    https://coins.ha.com/c/search-resul...tiny&limitTo=all&ic4=KeywordSearch-A-K-071316


    The difference in the two looks is pretty easy to see in my eyes and it apparently is for most others as well as the two words are commonly used to describe the luster on various coins.
     
    GDJMSP, May 10, 2019
    #29 + Quote Reply
  11. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    Thanks. Proofs i get. You answered my question well. Kinda kinda get it. But still will be on my side of the fence but i do get it. I like when you make me find a common ground
     
    Cheech9712, May 10, 2019
    #30 + Quote Reply
  12. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    Help me find common ground
     
    Cheech9712, May 10, 2019
    #31 + Quote Reply
  13. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    The coin is extremely frosty I would love to see what the reverse looks like!
     
    Pickin and Grinin, May 10, 2019
    #32 + Quote Reply
  14. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    And I "get" that. It's precisely why I said what I did in my 1st post - everybody has their own personal definition of what constitutes one and what constitutes the other.

    There are several classifications, names if you will, that are commonly used to describe the luster on a coin. Frosty and satiny are only two of them, the others are brilliant and matte. And if you want to see things start to get confusing, try comparing satin to matte :)
     
    GDJMSP, May 11, 2019
    #33 + Quote Reply
    ldhair likes this.
  15. Michael Scarn

    Michael Scarn Member

    I stealth-added a pic of the reverse to the first post earlier, but here is another one that shows the "frosty" appearance a little better (albeit a tad exaggerated). Sorry for the soft focus. Coin photos are hard!

    20190511_115909 - Copy (CT).jpg
     
    Michael Scarn, May 11, 2019
    #34 + Quote Reply
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  16. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    Nice frosty coin. I like it and I would say that it was a good buy.
     
    Pickin and Grinin, May 11, 2019
    #35 + Quote Reply
  17. buckeye73

    buckeye73 Well-Known Member

    There is a reason that 7 seemingly knowledgeable people guested either MS 64 or 65, including one MS 65+. Also, no mention of MS 66 or MS 66+ before the reveal. If we extrapolate grade-flation another 15 years, this coin would likely be re-submitted and graded MS 68+ with 2 CACs.

    This coin is indeed a Choice, if not Gem coin. Congrats on the purchase...my issue is grade-flation, in which the grading services are putting less importance on the technical grade, with due regard to strength of strike.

    Please forgive my rant!
     
    buckeye73, May 12, 2019
    #36 + Quote Reply
  18. johnmilton

    johnmilton Well-Known Member

    The grading services are into grade-flation to stimulate the flagging market for their product. In the more honest, older days, a coin that graded MS-66 or better had both superior preservation and was well made i.e. well struck and lustrous. With this piece, the preservation part has been watered down to make it an MS-66+.

    The effects of this are not good for collectors. Similar pieces with a bigger disturbance on the face will MS-63 and 64 grades. In the past they got AU-58 or maybe MS-62.
     
    johnmilton, May 12, 2019
    #37 + Quote Reply
    buckeye73 and Mainebill like this.
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