OK, out hunting for Halves and $2 bills today and while talking to a teller, I found out that recently a teller in the branch had received 4 rolls of Franklins. The teller bought them for themselves and sold them to a local dealer (I think I know which one it is). She said the teller received twice face value. The look on her face was pure disappointment when I stated that Franklins go for 13 times their face value right now based on the silver content alone. So my question is, who's compass was more out of whack, the teller for not saying anything to the customer or the dealer for paying such a ridiculously low price?
sounds like the teller had karma catch up to them for what they did. they ripped off the customer IMO, and the dealer ripped them off. both are equally wrong in my book.
Let's put ourselves in the teller's position. If we worked at a bank and saw something interesting come in, wouldn't we do the same? It's not as though a client was in line and asked for the rolls, then the teller found out what they were and kept them.
From a legal and ethical standpoint, the bank and its employees are NOT coin dealers. The customer DEPOSITED rolls of US coins into their account (or cashed out). The bank passes out and takes in currency regardless of their age, metal content or grade at face value. So long as there is no policy laid down by the bank regarding the "buying" of customer coins by tellers, I say... :thumb: Great opportunistic snag on the teller's part. I think it sits oddly in your (and my) gut because it didn't cross our "window".
Legally, the teller did nothing wrong. While I know (and encourage) tellers that tell customers that they are depositing something worth more than face, but gladly buy it once the customer deposits it. Usually it's IKE's, but occasionally silver pops up. Most customers don't want to be bothered and still deposit it anyway. Again there's nothing illegal about not saying anything, but it's bad karma. Now a dealer only pay 2 times face value for 90% silver may be illegal. If the dealer advertises things like "we pay top dollar" or "honest appraisals", then who here would feel that the dealer committed false advertising. Since it's all second information, I won't pass judgement (hence I'm not posting the name), but I do feel this is another data point indicated I should avoid the dealer in question.
I find it kinda hard to believe a B&M dealer would cheat THAT much, lol. 2X face? C'mon, somebodys pulling YOUR leg too, and I think it is the teller.
from gatzdon's description, it isn't even clear that the teller who purchased the coins from the till was the one who accepted the deposit from the customer. and if that was the case, it isn't clear that the teller took the time to carefully examine the rolls and determine that the customer had handed over valuable coins before the customer had accepted the cash / deposit and hit the road. so i'd be really loathe to say that the teller did anything wrong without knowing more. however, i'd be much quicker to judge the dealer -- he or she clearly knew the baseline value of the coins, and took advantage of an unknowledgeable seller. times might be tough, but that's not even a *ballpark* reasonable offer. profit is one thing, and near theft is another. caveat seller, i suppose. v.
i agree! there is nothign tellign us the teller who bought and then got ripped off by the dealer, knew what was in the rolls when they were accepted from the customer. We do know she got ripped off! shame on that dealer! If the teller knew what was in the rolls when they are taken in from the customer - shame on her as well! But lets hope she found them after the fact of deposit!
If that actually did happen I have no problem with the teller (other than laziness and stupidity for not looking into it further). As for the dealer. Capital punishment leaps to mind.
Okay, let's take a step back for a moment. Say what you will, but for her lack of expertise she did DOUBLE UP on her investment. I doubt very much she even knew they were silver, she probably thought they were just "old". Had she just looked at craigslist she would have found out that people are paying up to 13.5X face (at least they are in San Francisco). Oh well...
Perhaps but seeing that it appears Gatzdon is a "regular" how hard would it be to ask him? I've bought from people at "fair market value" in the past and even when silver was LOW it was well over double face value. I'm sticking with Capital punishment.
I don't think the teller did anything legally wrong by accepting the silver at her window and later buying it for herself. BUT If that dealer is an ANA memeber dealer he is in violation of the ANA's Code of Ethics for member dealers. The COE for member dealers states (in part): As an ANA member dealer, I agree to comply with the following principles: . . . To purchase and sell numismatic items at prices commensurate with a reasonable return to the seller and for a reasonable return on my investment with regards to the prevailing rate. . . . Any violation of this code will be grounds for expulsion from the American Numismatic Association. If the teller could tell you who the dealer is it would be very simple to find out if he is a member of the ANA. If he is an ANA member I would suggest to the teller that she immediately report him for unethical behavior. Then he will have to decide if $440 (the amount he ripped the teller off) is worth losing his ANA membership.
Man, I wouldn't go saying the teller was wrong not telling the customer, we don't know if she knew what was in the rolls at the time. It might have happened where the person deposited them or just turned them in, and she checked them later when it was too late. I do feel the dealer was wrong, except I don't know the full story there, as we only have what someone said, which can be confused in itself. Phoenix
Clembo, don't get me wrong, I agree with you whole heartedly. This dealer took complete advantage of her But rather than making the teller out to be too much of a victim, I sought to find the "silver lining" in the story (yes, pun intended).
The teller did nothing wrong. She saw old coins and bought them out of the till. Big deal. We do the same thing when we roll search. The dealer is scum for not giving her more for those Franklin's. However, she should have done some research on the coins to find out their value before she sold them. Her loss. I don't feel sorry for people that lose money because they can't be bothered to do research before they make a deal.
Gatzdon, the only thing I would add is that, since it's second or third hand, it could well be that there were 1 or 2 Franklins but most of the rolls were 40% silver halves, in which case, although still low, double face value doesn't surprise me as much especially considering how dealers seem to dislike 40% junk silver. I've just run across too many misinformed tellers in my quest for halves- maybe they do know what they're talking about but it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't. Anyways, just a thought.
This definitely falls under finders keepers. As started above, it is no different from our roll searching. But-- That dealer was very greedy!
Everyone is free to justify it in any way that clears their conscience, but what the teller did was morally wrong even if it is legally permitted. None of us wants to think of ourselves as bad people if we recognize that we would do the same thing, but we are. What the dealer did is equally morally wrong even if legally correct. Both of their actions went far beyond roll searching, which is entirely different than the blatant and deliberate deception by the teller and dealer. What they did is closer to seeing a wallet fall out of someone's pocket, then picking it up and keeping it instead of handing it back to the owner.
I live in an area with a large percentage of older folks that seem to occasionally take in notes to the bank that are older. About two weeks ago when I got my weeks supply of $2 bills I got two 1953's and one 1963 in the mix. But occasionally something fascinating comes into banks, and most of the tellers around here seem to know enough to tell people to take the item to the coin shop, for instance $500 and $1000 bills which come into the coin shop locally were usually first taken to a bank. The tellers obviously cannot afford to buy something that large, plus these notes are usually valued at 150% of face these days in average circulated condition.
