A Victory For The Little People: eBay Now Requires "Copy" In Description AND Title

The just came out on eBay's Coins and Paper Money Forum:
http://forums.ebay.com/db1/forum.jsp?forum=8

My name is Lia and I am the new person responsible for the Coins and Stamps categories. I am very excited to be at eBay! Needless to say, I have a lot to learn about eBay and the very interesting categories of Coins and Stamps. I have been spending a lot of time in meetings and trainings and look forward to attending some trade shows soon. Please stop by the eBay booth if you see us at a show!

I sincerely apologize for the delay in addressing your suggestions re: our Coins Code of Conduct. Please know that we were listening and we did hear you.

The good news is that a revised Code of Conduct was just posted on the site! http://pages.ebay.com/coins_code_of_conduct/
You will notice in #3 under the first bullet point that we now require that “the listing title AND description clearly state that the item is a copy or reproduction”. You may also notice that a note was added re: restrikes. “Note: Restrikes are permitted for sale and they are not required to have “copy” or “reproduction” incused in the metal or printed on the paper thereof, if the item was produced or authorized for minting by the original issuing government.” In the future, you can find this Coins Code of Conduct through the "Guidelines for Selling Coins" link on the Coins & Paper Money category portal page at http://coins.ebay.com

At the same time, we revised our answer to the Frequently Asked Question, “I have a fake coin – how can I list it on eBay”, which is under the Selling Coins Policy at: http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-coins.html There you will see that “title and/or description” was changed to “title AND description”. In the future, you can find this Selling Coins Policy through the "Selling Coins on eBay" link at the bottom of the Coins Code of Conduct page.

We hope that we have addressed your main concerns. Please continue to give us your feedback. Please also continue to report listings violations through the link at the bottom of the Selling Coins Policy page: http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-coins.html This is the same link that Lulu refers to at the top of her posting titled “Reporting suspicious listings & reminder of Board Usage policies,” which is tacked to the top of this Coins & Paper Money Discussion Board.

Thank you so much for your passion and interest in the Coins & Paper Money categories on eBay. We realize that there are some tough issues out there, and look forward to figuring them out together! In the meantime, I will check in on this Discussion Board periodically.

Have a great day!

Lia

This new policy and Code of Conduct for listing coins is long overdue and should go a long way toward reducing fraud and other deceptive selling practices with regard to copies and reproductions. It might even put a dent into a certain Savannah seller's business although she might easily plead ignorance if she gets caught.

 

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Morganfred

I see a policy but no mention of liability should someone ignore the policy, ebay works very slow in protecting the buyers, and in most cases does nothing to the sellers, I know from personal experiance !!

Its a real problem due to the fact that ebay has no responsiblity to the buyer,they pay nothing and recieve about the same in service.

 

This is a good step, but as Metalman said, eBay has been slow to respond to fraudulent coin auctions in the past. Extra rules won't do much unless they also show the willingness to aggressively enforce them.

 

This is something I've been lobbying for a long time. To have to include the the word in the title AND description is going to make the turn-around time on reports much shorter. Lengthy review will not be necessary any longer. Violation of the codes of conduct can and has resulted in being booted from eBay. I think it might be a "3 strikes and you're out" policy but I have seen some sellers removed for the first infraction. Although eBay is notorious for slow, red-tape filled workings, I think this is a strong step toward improvement.

 

Anyone else unnerved by the fact that the person in charge of this segment brings no prior knowledge to the table?

 

The last guy they had as Acting Manager didn't have any knowledge either, but he had a genuine desire to improve things. It could work two ways: Either she wants to learn as quickly as possible, understands the problems that she's up against, and genuinely wants to improve things. Or she doesn't know anything, just wants to look like she cares, and will continue in this position until eBay moves her again. Part of the problem with eBay is that they move their personnel around constantly.

I always prefer to look at the upside and give the benefit of the doubt. It's not like I have any control over who they put in that position anyway and I don't need to lose sleep over something I have no control over. I'll hope for the best and continue to report as many as possible.

 

Having someone in who is not knowledgable about coins could actually be a good thing. They are less inclined to be biased and will hopefully follow the rules more rigidly... it'll be a case of "i have no knowledge on coins thus no power in that department, but i do have the rules and i can throw the book at people who don't respect them".

And someone who knows coins might actually get too involved... it'a not really MS66 it's actually 65... but that's really up to the buyers' judgement when all said and done.

 

Actually, this new policy will hold Ebay completely harmless in a transaction involving coin fraud. I think that is the bottom line, here.

I collect and occasionally sell Gallery Mint coin reproductions on Ebay and always try to include in the title and description a note that what I am selling is a COPY, but once in a while I overlook that and will only mention in the title or the description. There are some self-appointed 'Ebay police' out there that will quickly remind me that I am selling a FAKE piece of scrap metal and should describe it as such. I can't bring myself to go that far, but I have no problem with saying it is a COPY or REPRODUCTION, just sometimes I forget (a senior moment, you know).

Also, I don't really have a problem with a manager not being an expert in the coin business as long as she is an expert manager and can figure out what is good advice and what is something else. Sounds like she is on the right track.

 

Ever read the Dilbert Principle??

 

A late 70's management theory was the Peter Principle which said, "People will be promoted to one level beyond their competency." (Basically anyone who is good at there job is rewarded with a promotion. The cumulative effect being that eventually every competent employee will be promoted beyond their level of competency.)

One 90's management psuedo-theory was the Dilbert Principle which said that, "Idiots are promoted directly to the place where they can do the organization the least harm, management. Thus allowing the competent employees to continue keeping the organization functioning properly."


That must be what you're insinuating is happening at eBay. lol

 

Exactly, though I hope not.

 

Yes, unfortunately. My feeling is that the odds are in our favor to get someone at least semi-competent at least once a year (just by accident, of course)

 

Anyone see the BIG flaw in the new policy?

You may also notice that a note was added re: restrikes. “Note: Restrikes are permitted for sale and they are not required to have “copy” or “reproduction” incused in the metal or printed on the paper thereof, if the item was produced or authorized for minting by the original issuing government.”

Now we will have all of the fakes and unmarked copies being called "restrikes" in the description somewhere with the implication that they are an official restrike.

 

I don't think it's going to be a problem. Regardless of what the sellers say in the descriptions, they will still be easy to spot, and easy to report. If a coin is inaccurately described as a "US Mint Authorized Restrike" and they are lying, maybe the new regulation disallowing people to use the Mint's name to endorse fraudulent products will kick in (once it passes). At that point, the US Mint gets involved - an awfully big organization that might enjoy the publicity.....hmmm