Ethics Observation

To borrow a line from National Treasure, those who have the ability to take action, have the responsibility to take action. Those who care will act, buyers or sellers, unfortunatly some people are not as honest as we are and some people will try and take advantage of the rules.

 

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GD, I'm sure you right and it will be proven shortly in a court of law. However, the court of public opinion is another matter altogether.

Take care
Ben

 

The above was a suggestion.

Some of the problems as I think this would address is

1. Keep dishonest sellers from trying to knock the competition out anonymously (it takes at least 25 transactions to get an ID with feedback of 25)
2. Allows eBay to take meaningful action against ID's that repeatedly submit false reports.
3. Allows eBay to ignore erroneous reports (it's easy for one person to report an item erroneously, but for 5....)

4. If eBay were to start a tracking system for ID's that report auctions, it can start to associate a "confidence rating" or similar with those ID's. This seqways into an automated system where the computer can automatically yank auctions that have been reported by 5 separate individuals with very high confidence ratings. After a while, this would take a lot of burden off of eBay's shoulders for controlling scam artists and put it back in the hands of the experts paying to use their auction boards.

 

The problem as I see it now is ebay added a button to report auctions, but this button is no different than the thermostat on the wall in your office. It's there so when you feel the need to do something, you can fiddle with the controls, but it's not hooked up to anything.

 

I think if your going to spend all day looking for ebay sellars to report and attack. You should get a job working for Ebay. Or better yet get a job. Why spend all your time looking to make problems for others. Karma is gonna get ya. If there Bad sellers selling junk good for them there a junk dealer.

 

I've noticed over the years karma's reflexives are sure getting faster every time I do something bad...

 

You certainly have a way of stating the obvious.

 

This is a very good thread. After reading it all, there is little I can add. I stopped buying on Ebay about 3 years ago [I think] because it just seemed too dangerous. Maybe people expect too much from the world's largest garage sale. Buying an expensive coin from Ebay isn't much different from walking up some stranger's driveway and handing him a wad of cash. If you plan to do it, you had better really really know what you are doing. I know many legitimate coin and other businesses have made use of Ebay as another sales outlet, but they must also realize the type of selling outlet that it is, and that they have set up shop at the sleazy end of town. So it should be policed as well as possible with full realization that the effort will probably fail.

 

Wetspants,

I've taken the time to read all of your posts including one in a thread that I started. I can see your CoinTalk fan base growing by the minute.

You really seem to applaud the ebay sellers that rip people off. "The American way". We should get jobs working for ebay or get jobs. Highly intelligent and insightful posts I MUST say.

Well, as it turns out most of us here do have jobs. From all over the spectrum of jobs. Some are retired and had jobs and made an honest living so they could retire in relative comfort. We respect one another which seems to be a foreign concept to you. How dare we peruse ebay auctions and point out crooks, scammers and cheats!

So I have to ask are you selling on ebay these days? If so what? You seem awfully defensive of pond scum.

Only my opinion of course and I do have a job. I'm a painter.

clembo

 

Selling on Ebay does not require anyone to set up shop in the ghetto, or use ghetto tactics or unsavory methods.

It is the integrity of the individual and the way they conduct themselves that makes their particular auctions or website ghetto, not the street they keep shop on or the web address.

I find the comments along the lines of " power to the shysters " to be more descriptive of the commentor than the marketplace itself.

It is the respect for other members and the look out / heads up givin here that make this such a great site. There is no cover charge, no membership fees and no elite......everybody is welcome here untill they , by their own behaivor get tossed. Yes, we even allow trolls here on occasion.



Thanks for the free chuckle !!!

 

BRAVO SIR... I totally agree with you. I sell on Ebay because I have a fixed income. I work for good ole Uncle Sam and I get paid on the 1st and 15th. A lot of folks think Military Pay is nice.. well it pays the bills and that is about it. I like to have a few extra dollars to take my kids to the movies or to get ice cream once and a while. I also LOVE coins and this is about the only practical way for me to do it.

I work hard for a living protecting this country and I am sure that there are QUITE a MAJORITY of folks here that are upstanding individuals!!! There are a lot of scammers and cheats out there but I am glad that I for one am NOT one of them and I am glad that I can get an honest opinion on here about items with out reprisal. I try my best to put out there the best possible products for my customers. If ANYBODY gets a coin from me I want them to be happy with it.

I encourage that if anyone wants they are more than welcome to come and check out my auctions. If they feel a coin doesn't meet their standard send it back to me no harm no foul.

I will get off of my soapbox now!! =)

 

Bravo Sir to you Tdec.....As the father of a daughter in the Navy, I applaud your service to this great nation !!!!

Back to topic...your also one of the goodguys, don't let the trolls get to you or make you feel you have to defend yourself.

 

I hope there is karma, I would like to think we are saving many from the few.
To add, there is nothing wrong with a junk dealer, unless the junk being sold is advertised as genuine or valuable.

 

All I was saying is its E-bays job to keep people from selling a coin that's VF at best as MS67? Yes it is, And if there's anyone you should be breathing down the neck of, its Ebay its self not some snake oil sales men. THEY WILL NOT LISTEN TO YOU. They will how ever listen to Ebay. I applaud those of you that want to sit in front of your computer all day and report people for trying to pull a scam. But I really don't think every seller being reported out there is actually trying to pull a scam. I don't sell anything on E-bay. Because I know better. I buy a little bit here and there when I KNOW WHAT IM BUYING. Knowledge is key. If you don't know what your buying then why are you buying it. Get a book before you get a coin. That should be what you are preaching here more then REPORT every Tom, Dick and Harry that starts selling on ebay. I mean really is EVERYONE out to get you? How about the guys from the SHOP AT HOME network? Why isn't some one trying to stop them or the Morgan mint on TV? Those if you ask me, are a much bigger threat to the numismatic world then some small time wonna be coin dealer on Ebay.

Let me make one thing clear, I wasn't attacking anyone for reporting FALSE and misleading sellers on ebay I was simply stating that if you have to time sit at your computer and point fingers. Then Get on the phone and call ebay telling them they need to change there ways when it come to coins and NEED to hire some people like your self's to track follow and stop scammer's. Simple as that. Why keep stocking people for free. You may as well get paid for it.

On top of that, I see a lot of people selling coins on ebay that don't even know what there selling. Like the guy selling a RAW MSGRADE 1964 Quarter for a 100 Dollars. Should his listing be stopped because he's hopping he will get a 100 Dollars for it? I don't think so. I think he should learn that its not worth more the $3 bucks before listing it. Or watch for a week as no one bids and have him learn that way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wetspants
I think if your going to spend all day looking for ebay sellers to report and attack. You should get a job working for Ebay. Or better yet get a job. Why spend all your time looking to make problems for others. Karma is gonna get ya. If there Bad sellers selling junk good for them there a junk dealer.

I hope there is karma, I would like to think we are saving many from the few.
To add, there is nothing wrong with a junk dealer, unless the junk being sold is advertised as genuine or valuable.

ViperGTS got me best. Again I was just saying if there a JUNK dealer? Then they are slinging JUNK and you already know it. Why as long as there not saying its much better then it is go and report them. Why cant they sell it. I mean they got it from some where most likely at a cost to them. Why shouldn't they be able to turn around and sell it. What this all boils down to is. Sure scammers suck and there on every corner. But that's how it has been for as long as there has been free trade. YOU THE CONSUMER should be more agitated. The only way these people on EBAY will be stopped is if. Those of you that are spending you time reporting them GET TOGETHER and a GROUP and stand as one. Not as one random person's opinion but as a MASS or a GROUP of opinion's. You can't win a war one shot at a time.

 

When a dilligent coin buyer is searching auctions for good buys (or even just specific coins they want) and comes across a fraudulent listing, at that point, the differential effort to report it is insignificant, yet if eBay responded in a meaningful way to those reports, the benefits could be substantial.

 

I agree with that.

 

It is to bad that people have to be protected from themselves, but it drives me nuts seeing some of these bogus coins selling for big $$$. I don't know which is worse a buyer getting taken, or the seller profiting from it. In the end it should be buyer beware, but.....

 

I have little to no sympathy for the person that buys into the scams but look at it more this way.

You see a drunk driver on the road, you can

1. Flag down a cop and point him out.
2. Drive on by and hope he plows into a Telephone Pole.
3. Realize that there is a small chance that he plows into an innocent driver. Sure, a defensive driver should be able to avoid the drunk, but there are people who don't scan both sides before entering an intersection with a green light, willingly pass the drunk driver because he's going to slow, etc...

By flagging down the cop, you have potentially saved an innocent driver from getting into an accident they didn't deserve, but could have avoided by being a more experienced defensive driver.

By reporting and getting a fraudulent listing yanked, you have potentially saved an inexperienced YN from making a poor buying decision despite the fact that they could have avoided it anyway by being a more experienced, savy collector.

 

Agreed, if any body knows a good way to slow them down, that would be great, but it's not like you can click a botton everytime they try and sell an overpriced coin. You could tell the producers, but they are setting the prices.