Why did I buy this denarius?

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by dougsmit, Jan 25, 2019.

  1. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    My latest acquisition came from a very old friend (take that as you wish but I have known him a while) who commented that I was suprised I ordered that coin. That got me started wondering if he knew more about what I find attractive or desirable in a coin than I do. I'll describe a few of its features but that does not mean that any of those features cause it to be attractive to me. I can find something interesting about most ancient coins. Since I got the coin in the mail yesterday, I discovered a few other things about it that I find interesting but that may say as much about the nature of my disease as it does about the coin. Some of you know I have been taking some close ups of small sections of some of my coins. You probably suspect I am on the payroll of microscope manufacturers (I'm not but if you are a manufacturer and want to give me a new trinocular stereoscopic scope, I'll take it). I'll start by showing a small part of the obverse of the coin.
    rc2315fd3473in1.jpg

    There are a lot of things to see in this photo. My favorite is the two rows of three dots which I believe to be the double pearls mentioned in BMCRE as one of the options for coins of this ruler and period even though they did not have this reverse listed with that option. You may or may not know that I think assigning importance to the kind of hair hardware shown and requiring us to decide what we have before we get a catalog number is one of the reasons I have so little respect for collecting by catalog number. This image also shows some artifacts of striking and toning that I find interesting. Sure you can see such things 'in hand' and in low resolution photos but I like my photos better. Does this photo show why I liked this coin? Maybe. My wife just told me it is time to make supper (my turn) so I will have to add more to this later. I know one of you can ID this coin from this teaser and most won't read this far in one of my run-on threads so I'll leave with the question of what this photo shows that may or may not be of interest. Ruler? Date? Would a real expert (not I!!!) be able to ID this coin from this photo? Very possibly!
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2019
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  3. Kentucky

    Kentucky Supporter! Supporter

    I bet someone (not me) will!
     
  4. TIF

    TIF Always learning.

    I think it is a deceptively rotated closeup of Faustina Sr's hairstyle, the top/back of her bun... or if the image isn't misrotated, Faustina Jr's bun.
     
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  5. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    My second photo shows a slightly larger section of the reverse of this coin. It shows a slightly unusual arrangement catalogs describe as an arm resting on a cornucopia that is placed next to the seat rather than held in arms as usual. Below the seat is a globe which my slightly worn specimen shows to have had bands (astrolabe?) which should be more of interest to people interested in astronomy than it is to me. Do these characteristics have anything to do with my buying the coin? Not really. I do find these points interesting to a degree but that takes us back to my desire to find something interesting in the coin after the fact.
    These characteristics will ID the coin but again only for people who have studied these as a specialty. I do not. Perhaps that is why the seller was surprised I bought this coin. Perhaps it is true that I'll buy anything at least if it is fairly priced. The seller, our own Valentinian, tends to be fairly priced IMHO but that may be because he tends to have coins that have some interest other than their being mint state. I did not have one of these. Now I do. I did not know I wanted one of these. That one I can not explain.
    rc2315fd3473in2.jpg

    It hurts me that anyone would think I am being deceptive. Up is up. It is not Faustina Sr.
     
  6. TIF

    TIF Always learning.

    Faustina Jr denarius, Concordia reverse. Final answer, Regis :D. I'm not sure of your reasons for buying the coin but look forward to that explanation :).

    Yes, you are such a little angel :angelic:. :p :D
     
  7. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    The last coin I bought in 2018 was an Alexandrian tetradrachm of Faustina II. While researching it, I became aware that this daughter of Antoninus Pius sported quite a number of variations of hairstyles in her younger days. I am not a specialist in coins of empresses or a fan of fancy hair styles but I could see how someone who found those things interesting might want to specialize in the lifetime coinage of this lady. I had some of her coins of Rome but no denarius this early an with anything like the hair on Valentinian's coin.
    pa0300fd2085.jpg

    Now I do. Why did I like that coin. I have no idea. Anyone care to talk me thrugh what they consider to be the proper reference number for it in BMCRE? I do not have that volume of RIC so I don't know how they handled the pearls.
    rc2315fd3473.jpg
     
  8. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    When I get home from work, I'll post the BMCRE4 listing for this coin.
     
  9. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    I could not find what I considered a full match. I will be interested in seeing what you say.
     
  10. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    There are three coins in BMC with this reverse design: 1086-1088. Of these, 1086 and 1087 have the same hairstyle as yours. The reverse dies differ in the break in the inscriptions, and the die-axis differs between 1086 and 1087, but neither of these features is of significance during the Antonine period.

    Here's the listing:

    Capture.JPG
    Capture 1.JPG

    Here are the actual coins in the British Museum collection:

    1086:
    1086.jpg

    1087:
    1087.jpg

    1088:
    1088.jpg
     
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  11. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Here's the classification of the various bust types and hairstyles on p. 158.

    Capture 3.JPG

    The band of pearls refers to a diadem of pearls, actually. Here's a double band of pearls:

    Faustina Jr FECVNDITAS denarius.jpg

    Single band:

    Faustina Jr PVDICITIA veil denarius 2.jpg
    Faustina Jr Hilaritas As.jpg

    Stephane and band of pearls:

    Faustina Jr VENERI GENETRICI Sestertius.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2019
  12. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    Thanks. Seeing several coins makes it possible to decipher the BMC listing better. My coin has a letter spacing unlike any of the BMC examples but that is minor and expected.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2019
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  13. jamesicus

    jamesicus Well-Known Member

    Each of your above postings are very instructive Doug. Great information!
     
  14. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    Not really. The matter shows how little I know about the Antonine period. To my unskilled eye, the coin looked 'different' but it turns out to be quite ordinary.
     
  15. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Last edited: Jan 26, 2019
  16. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    This was an interesting post. I dug through my Faustina II's and found what I think is BMC 1087, based on the spacing of the reverse legend. Mine has little "fingers" coming off the obverse bust near the forehead, off her hair - I am assuming this is just an aspect of striking and not a stephane?

    Faustina II Concordia Den. Oct 2013 (0).jpg

    Faustina II Concordia Den. Oct 2013 (1).jpg
     
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  17. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Not a stephane.
     
  18. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    Yeah, I didn't think so. The three spikes are probably nothing.

    As I understand it: sestertius with stephane (right) and without (left):

    Faustina II FELIC Feb 2018.jpg
     
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  19. tenbobbit

    tenbobbit Well-Known Member

    My poor version ( seen better days )
    My records show that I have the longer Obverse legend ( ANTONINI ) with Concordia standing but I am having difficulty locating it :confused:
    In reply to the reason you bought it Doug, who wouldn't ? A lovely example that is perfectly centered on a tight flan, strong details with little wear & nice toning.
    Certainly not " ordinary " for the type, I know I would ;)

    IMG_5175.JPG IMG_5176.JPG
     
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