Calling people names and falsely associating me with a random CU troll is hilarious on your part. I’ve already posted my CU account; I haven’t seen yours though. Funny how you turn to trolling when your propaganda is torn apart.
Not at all. I am just interested in legitimate discussions. A few members here seem to have gotten very upset for pointing out their limitations and have chosen to start trolling me for months now, there's no reason to take them seriously. Why they hate PCGS and CAC so much I don't know. Their little troll group makes it very difficult to have legitimate discussions
Yeah, I just make stuff up all the time huh ? But then you can find comments like this, made by a guy who has worked at most of the TPGs as grader. You might want to pay attention to the capitalized words. Then there's comments like these by another name you'll probably recognize - messydesk And he clearly states that standards for PL and DMPL have definitely changed over the years. And then you can find articles like this one on NGC's website - https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/1157/Bagne-Collection-of-Silver-Commemoratives/ - where NGC says the following. To qualify for the prooflike, or PL, designation at NGC, a coin must have 2 to 4 inches of reflectivity throughout the entire field area on both obverse and reverse. And if I searched long enough I could probably find where they also quantify DPL. And yeah, I am now aware that neither NGC or PCGS currently list the specific distances that each requires for the PL or DMPL/DPL designations. But there was a time when they did. Which is where information like that found in this on the NGC forum came from in years past. https://www.ngccoin.com/boards/topic/115116-dmpl-vs-pl/ DMPL Reflectivity Scale Here is the scale that denotes the proper designation for the coin, based on reflectivity: * Semi-Prooflike (SPL) - 1 to 2 inches, devices must be frosted * Prooflike (PL) - 2 to 4 inches of reflectivity * Deep Mirror Prooflike (DMPL) - More than 4 inches * Ultra Prooflike (UPL) - At least 8 inches The designation of Ultra Prooflike is not in widespread use, and qualifying coins are fairly rare. You might want to notice the date, it was 10 years ago that was posted. And it's kinda funny that it's different in some ways from what's used now isn't it. So ya see Kurt, the reason I say some things that I say is because I remember them when I read them. And I realize not everybody does. But I do, I don't just make things up and post them here. I post what I've learned over the years, things that perhaps others have not learned or simply don't remember. Things like the fact that standards for designations have changed. Things like the TPGs having info on their websites at one point in time, and then removing it because those standards have changed. They don't exactly want the general public to know things like that. For if they did then they might actually start asking questions and begin doubting what the TPGs tell them and or do presently. And stuff like that, well it just wouldn't do now would it. But I'll admit, perhaps I was wrong about NGC using UDPL/UPL, maybe it was ANACS and ICG that used it that I remembered. But the one thing in my original comments in this thread that I couldn't back up with actual quotes from other websites and/or quotes from other knowledgeable people is that NGC currently uses 8 inches as their requirement for DPL. But if I searched long enough I think I could find even that - confirmed by NGC. But you Kurt, yeah, you can go right on thinking that I just make stuff up all the time simply because you don't know it or haven't hear of it. But I got news for ya Kurt, there's a whole lot of stuff that you don't know. Nothing wrong with that, there's a lot of stuff I don't know either - but at least I admit it. And I don't go around accusing people of making stuff up just because I don't. Usually, I thank them for telling me something I didn't know.
No, I do NOT think you make stuff up, far from it, because I remember reading some of the exact same stuff you have. The difference is I let it go, because I have no expectation of it being even stable much less eternal. You simply have to never stop reading and learning the new ways. What is leading YOU to lead others astray, is an expectation of stability.
How can one ever lead someone else astray by relating true and accurate history to them ? It is only by studying the past that one can judge the accuracy and relevancy of the present. And if there is no stability in the grading and or special designations of coins, then what can possibly be said that is good about its current accuracy ? If the target is constantly moving, up or down, how does one ever know what he actually has at any given point in time ? With no stability it's kinda like going to the deli and saying you want to buy a pound of cheese. But when you get there they tell you a pound is now only 12 ounces and not 16 ounces anymore. But hey, good news, the price is the same ! With what we have going on with coins, a pound isn't 16 ounces anymore, it's only 12 now, and the price isn't the same either, it's gone up. So more good news huh ?? But no, people don't ever need to know things like that do they Kurt ?
Doug, I am nowhere near as troubled by the lack of consistency in this hobby’s standards as you are. I’ve become resigned to the fact that is actually the very essence of this hobby. Nothing is ever constant. Everything is always changing. Now..., is that an invitation for mischief? Oh my goodness, yes. In fact, I suggest that is the whole point. I believe that “ethics” and “numismatics” have a disturbingly small intersection set, and the proverbial “powers that be” pretty much want it EXACTLY that way. How else could the unholy alliance of dealers and graders extract maximum possible value from unwary collectors, that which I believe is the ONLY true goal? Cynical? Not nearly enough, Doug, not nearly enough. In this hobby, NO ONE is on “your side”. No one is trying to help enrich YOU, they’re all trying to enrich THEMSELVES at your expense.
By your own concerns your own grading standards are completely irrelevant then as well. You didn't learn the 1910s system of grading, or the 1880 system, or the midevil system ect. It has ALWAYS been changing and had changed countless times before you were ever born to learn what you did. This is exactly Kurts point, you seem to act like that you learned the best way and everything else is bad because it isn't yours and use change as an excuse. EVERY one of your complaints (which aren't even that accurate with today's grading) apply to the system you were brought up on. There would have been people just like you 50 years ago, a 100 years ago, a 1000 years ago, if there were internet forums at the time complaining about change and living in the past. Until you realize that the standards you were brought up on went through the same changes and are subject to the same always true complaints you keep making it's hard to take your issues seriously. If you do realize that then why is it fine for what you learned but not now?
If you want to teach them how things were or how things have changed, then yes, past methods can be used in education. But if you want to teach them how things are, (i.e. current standards) then no, you can lead them to believe something that is no longer true. Agreed?
How on earth would you know that? Have you ever actually owned a UDM? It takes mirrors that are stronger than a proof Morgan to get that designation. Ive owned one, @ddddd has also. Its obvious that you dont even collect dmpl Morgans, ALL you do is parrot others on the CU forum. Youre just some kid troll who collects PCGS-70 ASEs I can post photos of PL/DMPL Morgans straight from my box of 20- Can you?????
The storage boxes hold 20. Some people decided to thin their collection to the best coins they could fit in one box aka box of 20. A quality over quantity approach As far of the rest of what he said just pure trolling as usual
It’s a box of 20 coins. Some people like the type set way of collecting where there is no defined set, just 20 coins that you find most appealing.
The ONLY workable defense against what I believe is the essential nature of this hobby is what I do - MINIMIZE, to the extent possible, my nexus to traditional dealers AND third party graders. They are NOT there to help me, they are there to bleed me dry.
Its your collection of more valuable, higher end (slabbed coins) that fit neatly in ONE box..Mine all reside in a tupperware in my safe. @lordmarcovan has one of the more famous box of 20 collections here on CT
Typical post. You can’t back up your claims so you just turn to name calling. How about calling people racists again? That worked well for you last time.