My first Constantine coin!

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Pavlos, Oct 19, 2018.

  1. Orfew

    Orfew Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus

    I like your first coin of Constantine.
    This was my first coin of Constantine. Ex: Dattari collection

    Constantine RIC 38.png
     
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  3. Valentinian

    Valentinian Well-Known Member

    This is not quite stated right. Licinius was normal for the times and normal was with a short military beard. Constantine was different. He was the one doing something different. (I would like to see a citation of where some ancient historian says the lack of a beard had something to do with Christianity.)

    Under the tetrarchy each emperor issued coins in the names of the other emperors. This coin in not in the "style" of Constantine. It is in the style of Licinius, minted by Licinius, in the name of Constantine.
     
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  4. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    Some of my Constatine I Constantine I 24.jpg Constantine I 23.jpg Constantine I 27.jpg Constantine I 14.jpg
     
  5. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Lovely coin! Here's some information about the iconography and legend on the reverse.

    Jove is another name for Jupiter and IOVI CONSERVATORI is in the dative case and is Latin for Διί Σωτῆρι, and in English means "To Jupiter the Perserver/Protector/Defender." This was a common design on coins of the Roman empire. Coins with this reverse type depict Jupiter sitting or standing, with the god holding a Victory (Νίκη) in his right and the hasta (long scepter) in his left. The eagle at his feet is, of course, Jupiter's sacred animal. The image of Jupiter handing out a victory may symbolize a sacrifice that Constantine may have made to Jupiter, resulting in a victory through the help and assistance of the god.
     
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  6. Gavin Richardson

    Gavin Richardson Well-Known Member

    Great first Constantine!

    Roman Collector has done a nice job helping with the legend. Here's a little more info:

    Obverse: IMP C CONSTANTINVS PF AVG.

    The IMP stands for "Imperator," a term we might simply gloss as "emperor," but it originally had a military meaning of "commander," just like the President of the United States is also "Commander in Chief."

    I'm honestly not sure about the "extra" C before "CONSTANTINVS." It probably means "Caesar," another title, but Constantine did have "Gaius" as part of his name, so that can't be ruled out. Maybe @Victor_Clark can tell us.

    PF stands for "pius" and "felix," a fairly standard group of adjectives. "Pius" is related to English "pious," but the Latin term is more generous, since "pietas" is the Roman principle of being devoted to the gods, to family, and to country. Thus the "pius" man is marked by devotion to all the appropriate things for a Roman. "Felix" can mean a range of things--fortunate, happy, blessed.

    And of course, he is the "AVGustus," the supreme ruler, at least in the West.

    So I'd gloss the obverse something like, "The Commander [C?] Constantine, the Pious and Blessed Augustus."

    Reverse: IOVI CONSERVATORI AVGG N N / • TS•E

    Roman Collector has already parsed the reverse. The "dative case" just means that the endings of the words convey grammatical information; most Roman coin reverse legends are in the dative because this case indicates that this coin or legend is dedicated to the deity or concept named--in this case, to Jove.

    One interesting detail--when you see these forms terminating in an "extra" letter, it means there's more than one of something. We might expect AVG here, but we get AVGG with an extra G because there are two Augusti at this time--I presume Constantine and Licinius. The N here stands for the first-person possessive plural pronoun "our" in Latin--noster (genitive: nostri), but the two N's -NN- pattern with the two -GGs because of the two Augusti.

    So to borrow @Roman Collector's parsing, this coin reverse is struck "To Jupiter the Perserver/Protector/Defender of our Augusti."
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2018
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  7. Pavlos

    Pavlos You pick out the big men. I'll make them brave!

    Great, thank you for the explanations! I didn't know so much thought was behind the making of the Roman coins.
     
  8. S. Porter

    S. Porter Active Member

    (I would like to see a citation of where some ancient historian says the lack of a beard had something to do with Christianity.)

    Agree. Here is an article citing early Christian authors as saying the opposite, that beards are manly and Christian.

    "The beard also served as a sign of manhood in the early Christian community as the ability to grow facial hair separated men from boys.[10] Additionally, many influential early Church fathers promoted the beard as a sign of Christian manhood. Clement of Alexandria, for example, noted that the beard was a sign of man’s superior nature while Lactantius held that the beard contributed to the “beauty of manliness and strength.”[11] Indeed, eunuchs, who by means of their castration had lost the ability to grow facial hair, were no longer recognizable as men in the Christian community.[12]"

    https://apholt.com/2016/05/31/hair-beard-clothing-and-masculinity-in-early-christianity/

    Maybe Constantine just couldn't grow a nice beard.
     
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  9. randygeki

    randygeki Coin Collector

    Great coins all
     
  10. mmancevi

    mmancevi New Member

    I think it is interesting to note that since Augustus emperors had tried to establish a public image both in sculpture and coinage. Augustus established what I believe is referred to as the Julio-Claudian style that lasts until Nero breaks the tradition to follow his own star. Augustus lived to a ripe old age but always looks about 35 in all his images. The same holds true for Constantine I who once he took total power broke with his predecessors and reached back to Trajan for a model for his images and remains roughly the same age.
     
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  11. Gavin Richardson

    Gavin Richardson Well-Known Member

    interesting point. I was aware of this “ageless“ approach for Augustus, but hadn’t really thought about it for Constantine.
     
  12. cwart

    cwart Senior Member Supporter

    My first Constantine also happens to be my newest purchase...

    AM-0029obv.jpg AM-0029rev.jpg
     
  13. Al Kowsky

    Al Kowsky Well-Known Member

    Valentinian, I don't think you'll find any direct religious link to beards in the early Roman Christian era, however, Constantine I wanted to revive the image of early Roman emperors like Augustus who were clean shaven & didn't look like Greeks or barbarians. All the Roman emperors who followed the 1st Christian emperor were clean shaven until Julian II, who was a staunch pagan & wore a beard. The following emperor Jovian, returned to the "Christian look" by being clean shaven & this trend lasted until Justinian became emperor. Styles change with the times.
     
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  14. Gavin Richardson

    Gavin Richardson Well-Known Member

    Aw man, did you get that one from Warren at augustuscoins? I had my eye on that one for a while. It’s a beautiful coin. Good for you. Wish I could buy them all.
     
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  15. cwart

    cwart Senior Member Supporter

    I sure did... Sorry, just had to have that one... :D
     
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  16. Gavin Richardson

    Gavin Richardson Well-Known Member

    I don’t blame you. It’s a striking coin, and all of Warren’s coins are attractively priced. Good eye.
     
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  17. Clavdivs

    Clavdivs Well-Known Member

    Beards... I don
    Beards... I don't know.. I think that then as now it's all about the style of the times and accepted norms. Alexander The Great was clean shaven... as well as the Ptolemys.. I would assume that being clean shaven was also a sign of wealth as the time required (and the tools?) were not something that a common man would have (like being an avid golfer today - it takes time AND money! and most of us are short of one or both of those!).
    I believe Hadrian was the first Emperor to sport a beard.
    I read somewhere long ago (not sure if accurate) but that the common soldiers in the Legions were very happy when they saw the depiction of Hadrian on coins - they were free from shaving which I am sure was quite a chore back then.

    Hadrian's reign ended a decade or so before Clement of Alexandria was born... by then I would think the trend was already set.
     
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  18. Victor_Clark

    Victor_Clark all my best friends are dead Romans Dealer

    Sorry for the late response, but I just saw your tag. Yes, the C stands for Caesar. We know because of surviving edicts and inscriptions where it is spelled out. The Arch of Constantine has this as part of an inscription -- IMP • CAES • FL • CONSTANTINO • MAXIMO • P • F • AVGUSTO
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2018
  19. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    A few of the posts in this extended thread suggest some here might like to know more about the workshop system which resulted in the additional letters in the mintmarks or fields. The first coin in this thread showed an E following TS meaning the fifth workshop at Thessalonica. We have examples above of more than one of the ways that the workshops were numbered including a B which is the Greek numeral for the second workshop and an S for the ordinal secunda used for the second shop in some other mints. The entire subject of workshops is a bit complex because each mint did it 'their way' with between one and fifteen shops in use at one time. Some mints used a pattern with each shop dedicated to a different ruler while others just struck some for everyone at each shop. Anyone interested in an short summery of the subject is invited to read my page which really needs to be expanded to do anything approaching justice to the subject:
    http://www.forumancientcoins.com/dougsmith/officina.html
     
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