One chosen randomly out of 727

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Roman Collector, Sep 30, 2018.

  1. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    I don't have any new acquisitions to post so I thought I'd quite literally choose a coin at random and write about what makes it special. I used a random number generator to pick one out of the 727 items I have cataloged in my collection and it picked this one.

    Post anything you feel is relevant!

    Claudius II RESTITVTOR ORBIS Antoninianus.jpg
    Claudius II, AD 268-270.
    Roman silvered billon antoninianus, 3.66 g, 19.1 mm, 6 h.
    Siscia, issue 1, end AD 268.
    Obv: IMP CLAVDIVS CAES AVG, Bust right, radiate, cuirassed and draped with paludamentum, seen from rear.
    Rev: RESTITVTOR ORBIS, emperor in military dress standing l., holding patera over small altar in r. hand and spear pointing down in l. hand.
    Refs: RIC 189; MER/RIC temp no. 562; Cohen 247; Markl, Num Zeitschr v. 16, p. 427; Alfoldi 1936, 1.2.

    What makes it special?

    "Yeah, yeah," you say, "Claudius Gothicus coins are a dime a dozen." They are. I got this one back in 2016 for $8.83 per coin as part of a lot of twelve mid-late 3rd century bronzes from an Auctiones GmbH sale. HOWEVER, it's actually one of the scarcer issues by this emperor. No examples are to be found at acsearchinfo or the OCRE database. The only example on WildWinds was sold by Lanz on eBay in June 2010 for 101.78 Euros!

    It's one of Claudius II's first issues. MER/RIC and Markl (Numismatische Zeitschrift v. 16, p. 427) note it's from the first emission of the Siscia mint struck at the end of the year AD 268, which bear the obverse inscription IMP CLAVDIVS CAES AVG and bear no officina marks:

    Markl.JPG

    The Siscia mint portrait is quite well-rendered, if unexpressive. Although the span of this emperor's coinage was less than two years, the change in his portrait over time is dramatic. By the last year of his reign, the portraits have an almost cartoonish quality. This one, for example, resembles Jed Clampett, the character in The Beverly Hillbillies:

    Claudius II GENIVS AVG Antoninianus.JPG

    The randomly chosen coin has a fair amount of original silvering, and the flan is fairly large (especially compared to the issues from later in his reign). These qualities are not usually to be found on Claudius's later issues.

    Why RESTITVTOR ORBIS? The reverse inscription means "Restorer of the world." After an admittedly less-than-exhaustive internet search, I find nothing to suggest this particular coin was issued in response to a particular military victory or other event (though I'd love to know more about this). Rather, variations in the RESTITVTOR legend are common in the mid-third-century AD when there was much to restore. Indeed, the RESTITVTOR ORBIS legend is found also on the coins of Valerian I, Gallienus, Postumus, Aurelian, Tacitus, Probus, and Carus.
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
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  3. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    Neat group lot find, RC. Nice to see a very early Siscia CII portrait.

    I really like the random number generator at random.org, so I thought I'd give the Generate button a hit as well. Here my contribution... lucky number 2746, which as Fortuna would have it, just arrived a few days ago. :) Seller's pics, as I haven't taken my own yet.

    303432 BCD mystery coin 2 thyrsos.jpg
    UNCERTAIN. Circa 3rd-2nd centuries BC.
    AE15. 2.43g, 15.1mm. O: ΠΑΤΙ / ΚΩΝ (?) in two lines within wreath. R: Filleted thyrsos.
    Ex BCD Collection

    I'm afraid I've nothing much to say about it yet, but it would seem I'm in good company... the auction house helpfully informed potential bidders that "BCD kept this coin in his collection for decades, unable to attribute it!". How could I resist an invitation like that? :D

    The fabric is pretty distinctive, and there's a fair bit of design and legend visible, so hopefully it won't remain a mystery for another few decades. Unless someone here manages to identify it (which actually wouldn't surprise me), I'll get cracking when I'm back in town next week.
     
  4. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    Nice coin & write up. It's true that I rarely see that reverse of his.
     
    Roman Collector likes this.
  5. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    That's cool! I participated in that auction (bought Roman coins, of course) and was intrigued by several such coins that BCD had been unable to attribute. I'm glad that this one found a loving home. If you DO the seemingly-impossible -- attribute this one when BCD could not -- be sure to post it!
     
  6. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    You can bet I will! I managed to pick up three in that auction that were interesting to me. I've actually made some encouraging headway with one of them, though I'd say I only have a fraction of what's going on with it figured out so far. Mystery coins are fun!
     
  7. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    I'l play. Random.org said you need to see my coin #1359 which dates to the period when almost everything I was buying was a Septimius Severus denarius. This one was one of 18 coins I bought one day in March 1997 at a Baltimore coin show from Jonathan Kern. It was one of three that day with the reverse VICTOR SEVER AVG and, quite honestly the least of the three. Why did I buy three of the same reverse?
    rg1430bb1359.jpg

    At that time I was laboring under the misconception that coins of this reverse were rare. Each of the three had a different minor variation. The chances that random.org will ever pull the other two are pretty slim so you won't get to see them unless you go to my web pages on the subject. The chances that I will be buying more coins with this reverse are pretty slim, too, since they have turned out to be not all that special. They are not among the really common Emesa mint reverses but they are not as rare as I thought back then. If I were to see this coin today offered for what I paid then, would I buy it? Good question.


    VICTOR SEVER AVG coins replaced the much, much more rare VICTOR IVST AVG reverses which the mint had copied from the issues of Pescennius Niger whose name often included Iustus ('the just'). The mint at Emesa (or wherever it was) copied many of the reverse types of Pescennius' Antioch mint. I suspect this change followed orders from Septimius to get the offensive name Iustus off of his coins. I always wondered if someone at the mint suffered from making this mistake. 'SEVER' (the severe) was taken from Septimius' name and may not have played all that well with the emperor since later Victory types were shortened to VICTOR AVG.

    I really can't recall why I bought this coin 21 years ago. I usually would have avoided a coin with so much lost legend but it was easy to get carried away when going through Jonathan Kern's many bags of quite decent coins priced at $xx your pick (mostly priced by grade). This one has a distinctive die break over the TA on obverse right and might well have been the only other coin of that reverse in the bag. The other two were 'no brainer' selections. Perhaps I felt the need for one with the 'ordinary' legend ending in COSII. Those who want to see the others will find them among the five of this reverse shown on my web pages on this mint.
    http://www.forumancientcoins.com/dougsmith/mintsyr4.html
    http://www.forumancientcoins.com/dougsmith/mintsyr3.html
    Compulsive? Looking back, one might say so but there have not been as many of these offered recently as there was back in 1997 so maybe I thought ahead and decided I should get them while they were available???

    Random.org is an interesting way to pick the coin to be shown here. I do know that this coin would not have been selected otherwise but I still am keeping it and all its kin while I maintain the 'specialty interest' in Eastern mint Septimius coins. The coin show that produced this coin was less than a month after I posted the first of my web pages. I became much more of a general collector. I felt compelled to buy and study more different kinds of coins to provide material for my web pages (which became my new compulsion). Perhaps, after all, random.org did pick a reasonable coin to represent my collection.

    :):):)
     
  8. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    I really enjoyed this post, Roman Collector - interesting approach, this focus on a random coin in the collection. Your write-up was informative.

    Doug, as always I enjoy your reflections on your purchases - I still think you are too hard on yourself about duplicates. Ancients are usually so different in terms of workmanship that each one seems unique to me. That you pay so much attention to your coins is impressive. They deserve it, duplicate or not. For what it's worth, I agree that this VICTOR SEVER AVG reverse type is pretty scarce, at least from what I've seen eBay trolling.

    The post inspired me to go through my rinky-dink Claudius II collection. I found two that I bought together recently that had interesting SALVS reverses - Apollo and Isis. I don't know much about these, but I recall reading somewhere that the various SALVS types for Claudius may of had something to do with the illness that killed him (the plague?). I thought the opposite-facing busts made for a nice pairing:

    Claudius Gothicus Isis & Apollo Sep 18 (0).jpg

    Claudius II Gothicus
    Æ Antoninianus
    (268-270 A.D.)
    Antioch Mint

    IMP C CLAVDIVS AVG, Radiate head left / SALVS AVG, Apollo standing left holding branch and leaning on upright lyre.
    RIC 216 var.; Sear 11368.
    (2.95 grams / 20 mm)


    Claudius II Gothicus
    Æ Antoninianus
    (268-270 A.D.)
    Antioch Mint

    IMP C CLAVDIVS AVG, radiate, draped & cuirassed bust right / SALVS AVG, Isis Faria standing, holding sistrum and basket; Є in exergue.
    RIC 217 var; Normanby 1109.
    (3.34 grams / 21 mm)
     
  9. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    SALVS AVG also comes with
    Artemis and Apollo (with lyre)
    rq2148bb3143.jpg

    and Asklepios.
    rq2150bb1100.jpg

    I assume there are others. It seems in this period there are always others.
     
  10. Severus Alexander

    Severus Alexander find me at NumisForums

    Random.org picked coin 284, an akçe of Murad II (1421-1451):
    Screen Shot 2018-09-30 at 5.22.35 PM.jpg
    I have not catalogued this one well. Don't even know the mint. :oops:

    Neat thread! I love that OP Claudius... first emissions are cool. Random.org couldn't have picked this one because it doesn't yet have a collection number, but here's a first emission Aurelian that I recently picked up cheap, Siscia mint I believe (the seller had catalogued it about as much as I've catalogued my Murad II):
    Screen Shot 2018-09-30 at 5.26.01 PM.jpg
    Also appropriate because he looks kinda like Claudius II here.
     
  11. furryfrog02

    furryfrog02 Well-Known Member

    Great coins everyone. I like this idea of the randomly generated number to pick a coin to post about. I have not figured out the best way to catalog my collection so far.
     
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  12. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    Each of my coins gets two numbers. One is the sequence number of acquisition; the other is made up sequence that causes the photo files to sort in the order I want them to. My system might seem complex to many but it works for me and that is what counts to me. My two Claudius coins above are rq2148bb3143 and rq2150bb1100.
     
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  13. chrsmat71

    chrsmat71 I LIKE TURTLES!

    That's a cool idea @Roman Collector , I'm in the midst of a dry spell as well. I don't have a numbering system for my coins, I'm somewhat starting to organize them with a basic numbering system but don't have the majority of them done yet. I have been taking new pictures of some of my old coins, here is one new pic of what I thought was an old coin. It turned out to be a coin I had never taken a picture of.

    41da308c-5fb2-4f69-9554-c5d80729b370_zps12xlqtt5.jpg

    BULGARIA, Ivan Alexander, 1331-1371, AR.Grosch.

    O: Christ, nimbate, R: Ivan Alexander and son Michael Asen. 21 mm, 1.6 g.


    When I compared to my old picture, I realized it wasn't the same coin!

    [​IMG]

    I picked this up about 5 years ago as a lot of 3, I think I sold one on Ebay and sold one to CT member @Eng, keeping one for myself. So maybe this is ENG's coin?
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2018
  14. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    ...in order to have a random. org pick, you have to have order.. something my collection lacks a lil.. but i'll just throw in a Claudius ll Gothicus randomly picked by yours truly..i'm not sure whose on the reverse :) claudius ll salt and pepper cannons 001.JPG claudius ll salt and pepper cannons 002.JPG
     
  15. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    That's MARS VLTOR on the reverse. The obverse reads IMP C CLAVDIVS AVG and though much of the bust is off the flan, I think it's the bust right, radiate, cuirassed and draped type of RIC 66.
     
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  16. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    oh,thanks RC :)
     
  17. Silverlock

    Silverlock Well-Known Member

    I’ll play. Random.org gave me 39. I’m in the process of reentering everything into a new database, so this is number 39 of the 103 I have done so far.

    663B9A69-3D56-4F27-8F44-FBE797B9B388.jpeg
    43580BC5-FBEA-4BB9-9723-93D6AAC2D7CC.jpeg

    Ionia, Uncertain EL Phokaic standard
    Myshemihekte / Geometric shape
    Rosen 365
    Obv. Raised counterclockwise swastika pattern
    Rev. Quadripartite incuse square
    7.17 mm
    0.74 gm
    CNG 261 lot 110

    The story of this coin:
    I read the British Museum has a collection of over one million coins. During my first visit I marched right past the Rossetta Stone, ignored the Parthenon frieze, and made a bee line for the coin room, fully expecting to spend the entire day there. Imagine my surprise when there were only a few displays of ancient Greek and Roman coins, totaling a few score coins. The only exhibit that made a lasting impression was the “world’s oldest coin” exhibit, highlighted by a striated electrum from ca. 600 BC. I set out to add one to my collection. Never happened. But I did eventually add this tiny coin, which while it isn’t the earliest, is very early indeed.
     
  18. randygeki

    randygeki Coin Collector

    Neat coin and good write up.

    My random.org pick:


    1006205.JPG
    Gordian III AR Antoninianus, RIC 86, RSC 121
    IMP GORDIANVS PIVS FEL AVG, radiate, draped & cuirassed bust right / LAETITIA AVG N, Laetitia standing right with wreath & rudder .
    4.7 g.
     
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