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I just picked this one up. It's not rare and not even a rare or late die state. But it does have my initials counterstamped on the reverse.


It should make a great pocket piece.

 

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I thought I had already mentioned this, but I guess not. This came in today and I had forgotten my attribution already. But the Reverse and cracks once again revealed it and the obverse confirms it as a S-220 Die State VIII with what might be a new CUD filling in the space between the new cracks above ST and TES. It's hard to be sure with such a worn and corroded example.

Here is a COMP from Heritage Archives for the sole State VIII they have.

 

This one is going through some additional testing and analysis including XRF scanning; planning on writing a research article when all the data is in hand.

 

I'm confused.

 

I'm seeing a Nice C-4 with the Large 5 along with a die marker through the top of the 1 and a Reverse with stem with diagnostics for the C-4 and a marker from the bottom right of A towards the ribbon.

I think you're seeing more and I'd love to know what.

 

!!!

Struck fake (correct "Variety"); source example image:

 

Is the spike on the chin normal?

 

Here is another unwise buy. Sold as a possible coin from Joseph Crosby, whom I've never heard of. Now S.S.Crosby I've heard of. I do wonder with two J. Crosby's and three other initials if that might be the reasoning for the five pointed star.

Anyway, I think I've identified the obverse through the graffiti and believe it to be Sheldon Obverse 1 used on the S-144 and S-145.

No reverse image was shown. Now I will have to patiently await the coin to see the reverse. Is it the S-144 R5+ or the more likely S-145 R3? In either case, I will pick up examples of two additional dies not presently in my collection. $54.66 and just outside of the under $50 thread.

Here it is:

 

That little spur under the chin is referred to commonly as "Breen's Wart". It's mostly seen in the LDS of the 1805 C-4. Some of the EDS specimens supposedly lack this feature, however I don't think I've ever seen one that didn't show it to some degree. But the LDS examples always show this and it's quite prominent as in this coin.

 

I'm really getting off the rails.

This is a common S-229, but it's higher grade than I usually get and is even straight grades VG10 by PCGS. But it intrigues me because, despite it's being called a Die State I which is rare enough, it actually appears to be a die state between II and III having the crumbling N(T) of S-227 III specifically stated as absent in I and not mentioned in II which is also rare. But the obverse does not show any trace of the ARC crack through LIBERTY of III.

This is the presumed emission sequence described on a S-227 die state III.

The emission sequence is a little confusing: S-226, NC-1, S-229 States I and II, S-227, This coin fits here, S-229 State III, NC-2, and S-229 States IV through VII.

Up for your consideration is a 1802 Large Cent PCGS VG10, S-229. Breen Die State I. The slightly glossy chocolate and steel-brown surfaces show a thin scratch on the neck and a small planchet void in the right obverse field. The date and legends are easily legible.
Ex: Robert Shalowitz; Thomas Wolf; Pre-Long Beach Auction (Goldberg, 2/2008), lot 1270; Rod Burress (6/2008). (Includes Original paper flip and auction stickers).

9/8/2017 From The Padula Family Foundation Collection. (NGC ID# 224E, Variety PCGS# 36299, Base PCGS# 1470)
Auction 1259 | Lot 4423 » Large Cents

1802 1C S-229, B-6, R.2, VG10 PCGS....
Bid Source: HA.com/Live



I won this for about $162 which is $30 less than it sold for last year on the Heritage Auction. I've got to stop buying every coin that intrigues me though.

 

This is an enlargement of the crumbling N which is out of place for a Die State I or II and first appears in Die State III of the S-227 and remains when Die State III appears with it's Arc Crack through LIBERTY.

 

I've come across another example of this "new" Die state with a "perfect" Obverse and a crumbling N Reverse. It is also called a Die State I.


This confirmation coin pretty much rules out PMD as the cause of the "crumbling."

 

I'm now in search of any photographic examples of Die States I or II as described in Breen without the crumbling N. None are in the Heritage Archives.

"Die States: I. Obverse has blurred double clash marks. Reverse as in 5 (S-227) State I. The F AMER crack is shorter and feinter. No crumbling is visible on N(T). Dies misaligned with the weak areas at end of drapery and OF (corrected in later states). Rare. Clapp called it "Newcomb 4 Bb."

II. Feint crack joins tops of LI, later LIB. Reverse as number 5 (S-227) State II; the crack extends through F AMERIC. "Newcomb 4-Bc." Rare."

note - Crumbling on S-227 occur in Die State III so it would infer that there would be no crumbling on the N(T) on S-229 State II either.

None of the coins in the condition census has been identified as either Die State I or II.

 

I guess it's time to shut down the spending spree. I just splurged and finally purchased the six volume set by Noyes which along with my recent spate of purchases will require dipping into my retirement account.

But at least I will have six good books to keep me occupied until fiscal sanity is restored.

But don't take that sigh of relief just yet. Just because I'm not buying it doesn't mean I won't be here attributing coins. Just that I won't be buying them for a while.

 

Breen says that 229 I and II were struck before the LAST of 227. I believe the emission sequence would be
S-226, NC-1, S-227 I, II, and some of III, S-229 States I and II, re-marriage of S-227 III, S-229 State III, NC-2, and S-229 States IV through VII. Both 227 and 229 had interrupted marriages. That would result in the the crumbled N being on stages I and II of S-229 as well. I suspect Breen is wrong about S-229 not having the crumbled N because you obviously have an early stage 229 that does have it.

 

At this point, I can find no example to contradict that. This and 2 other coins identified as State I have this crumbling and none matching Breen's descriptions. This does appear to have the shortened break between F and AMER and no evidence of a crack over LI which otherwise matches State I.

 

This is one of the rarer coins I've seen unattributed on eBay. My bid didn't even come close. That's probably a good thing, at least for my finances.

 

It is tough to be the only one watching eBay to recognize a rare unattributed variety there!

 

Better images of the 1805 "C-4" and XRF scan courtesy NGC. Scan indicates copper with trace amounts of zinc, nickel and iron.

 

I found this today in the 50% off bin. Paid $15. What do you think?