Why wasn't this artist arrested for making multiple counterfeit U.S. cents?

No you were acting like something had changed from that memo, it didn’t

 

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Yes it did the changes in 'that memo' amended what was signed into law December 14, 2014. Again you can believe whatever you want but the law was updated with that memo
https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/pre...ssues-final-amendments-hobby-protection-rules
http://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?path=/prelim@title15/chapter48&edition=prelim

 

Not the parts you felt so pertinent to highlight like it was a game changer, it wasn’t and neither is anything said in this thread.

 

We've all heard your same complaints many times. You should expect the same response.

What I have altered does not meet the government's criteria of a copy of an original numismatic item. "The Hobby Act defines original numismatic items to include coins, tokens, paper money, and commemorative medals which have been part of a coinage or issue used in exchange or used to commemorate a person or event." 1964-D Peace Dollars were never issued or used in exchange.

Specific date aside, Gold Bullion International made copies of the German Wilhelm gold coin type. And then they deceptively marketed them as genuine German Mint products. A genuine original coin that has been altered to have a non-existant date is a completely different category.

 

This part appears in that same document (in the "Analysis" section after the part you quoted):

Lastly, the Commission does not propose modifying the Rules to ban the sale of fantasy coins outright. Sales of properly-marked fantasy coins are lawful under the Commission's decision in In re Gold Bullion discussed above, which held that vendors could sell coins with date variations so long as the coins are marked with the word `Copy.' ” 92 F.T.C. at 223. By contrast, the federal statute prohibiting the alteration of U.S. coins requires fraudulent intent. 18 U.S.C. 331. Accordingly, the Commission finds no grounds to adopt a rule banning fantasy coins.

The last two sentences are key. The GOLD Bullion International case did NOT involve the alteration of genuine coins. So what this is saying, basically, is that the Commission doesn't need to adopt any new rules because altering existing coins with fantasy elements is ok so long as there is no fraudulent intent.

 

I'd accept and prefer that gold 1 cent any day, no matter his intent!

 

Right, I wish people would try and “defraud” me like that

 

I'm a bit surprised that a 14kt gold cent only weighs 1 gram more than a normal copper cent.

 

You conveniently leave out the real key part 'properly marked fantasy coins' and 'coins are marked with the word 'Copy'' part as usual. There is no exemption to the marking requirements for 'imitation numismatic items' or 'fantasy' coins and never has been since the Gold Bullion Intl case was decided. And lets go back to that opinion which has is now the legal precedent what constitutes an 'imitation numismatic item' and how they are required to be marked.

 

It's not an imitation numismatic item. It's a numismatic item that has been altered. Why don't you get this. That's why I say Carr Derangement Syndrome. Because just like Trump haters the Carr haters see what they want and change the facts to fit their beliefs. Geez

 

So explain how the item retains it's original numismatic status despite being altered and changed into an item that meets the criteria of an imitation numismatic item which requires a copy mark? When an item is altered beyond recognition it ceases to be an original even if it's altered to appear to be. And it's immaterial what's being used to create the items the original ceases to exist once it's struck. Unless you contend that they retain their status as original numismatic items and thus legal tender as well. And in that case go and deposit one in the bank or send one to the U.S. mint and ask their opinion whether that status is retained.

 

And now it's back to talking hate and insulting remarks. Same thing every time this topic comes up.

 

There is no need to explain,
If the US government thought he, (DCarr) was in violation then they would have already strung him up, and halted all Fantasy O/S production. Have they? NO. Because he is not in violation.
I have bought from DCarr, and in no way, does he described a coin as a gov. issue.
What a buyer does with one of his pieces is out of DCarr's control, and then put into the hands of the gov. to prosecute if needed.

It's pretty obvious that your interpretation, and the governments is not the same.

 

Yet the government once again reiterated when updating the H.P.A that 'imitation numismatic items' must be marked. Whether or not the government takes action against something doesn't imply consent or that it's legal and they can be very slow when they do decide to address anything.

 

The Committee, in their final analysis, brought up the fact that altered US coins are only a violation if the altering is for fraudulent purposes. As such, the Committee stated it did not see a need to change any rules, even while being fully aware of "fantasy-date over-strikes":

"By contrast, the federal statute prohibiting the alteration of U.S. coins requires fraudulent intent. 18 U.S.C. 331. Accordingly, the Commission finds no grounds to adopt a rule banning fantasy coins."

 

Kripes, you guys make me sick.....

 

And once again the FTC way back in Gold Bullion Intl which was again restated as being the precedent case in determining the rules/regulations pertaining to copy marks when the H.P.A was updated. Had ruled that there is no requirement that knowledge or intent to deceive be shown in order to prove a violation of the hobby protection act. They also reiterate at the end of the opinion after all the suggestions that the coins must be marked already as set by the Gold Bullion case precedent.




And reading the exact wording in the updated H.P.A. which is excerpted below, I really can't see what position you or anyone else is using to argue that somehow your over strikes are exempt. Well except for the repeat claim that they are just an altered original numismatic item. Despite the fact they've been over struck and are no longer an original numismatic item, have lost legal tender status and thus no longer represent a government issued coin able to legally be passed in commerce.

'Notably, the Commission has addressed whether coins resembling
government-issued coins with date variations are subject to the Rules.
In re Gold Bullion Int’l, Ltd., 92 F.T.C. 196(1978). It concluded that such coins should be marked as a ‘‘COPY’’ because otherwise they could be mistaken for an original numismatic item. 22'

 

Bottom line: The Carr creations are legal unless the federal government takes action saying they are not and prevails in court. I’m sure Daniel did not venture into this without what he considered able legal advice.

 

My opinion original pieces by Carr ie non overstrike fantasy pieces are fine. I’m still of the opinion that the 64 peace dollars 1816 halves etc are going a bit too far. I’d rather have the original coin whatever the condition than this fantasy fake. Why not just stick to doing originals