Here in New Zealand,the numismatic trade are generally very conservative in grading coins.They use the following to grade coins; G. - Good. VG. - Very Good. F. - Fine. VF. - Very Fine. EF. - Extremely Fine. Unc. - Uncirculated. BU. - Brilliant Uncirculated. Prooflike. & Proof. We do not understand about MS-65 & all those things about American standards of grading.We even grade Canadian coins using the above conservative grading system.I personally cannot grade coins,but I know a lot of people who can.
To correlate that with US standards: Good: G4-G6 Very Good: VG8, VG10 Fine: F12, F15 Very Fine: VF20, VF25, VF30, VF35 Extremely Fine: EF40, EF45 About Uncirculated: AU50, AU53, AU55 Choice About Uncirculated: AU58 Uncirculated: MS60-MS62 Brilliant Uncirculated: MS63-MS64 Choice Uncirculated: MS65+
I'll take a stab at this. Us Yanks, for the most part, still use the very same terms. A little history... From the book, Photograde that I won right here at CoinTalk... In 1934, Wayte Raymond, a New York dealer and numismatic scholar launched the Standard Catalogue of United States Coins which went through 20 editions by the time he died in the 1950's. Grading was basic with terms as Good, Fine, Very Fine, Uncirculated and Proof employed. In 1954, the following grades were listed and explained: Proof, Uncirculated, EF, VF, F, VG, G and Fair. Numerical grading has its beginnings in the Sheldon Scale devised by Dr. William H. Sheldon. His first book, Early American Cents (later retitled to Penny Whimsy) in 1949 as part of a formula for determining the market value of United States Large Cents of the dates 1793-1814. Basically, Sheldon quantitatively reduced grading to numbers instead of descriptions. This scale goes from 1 to 70 (absolute perfect coin) where MS (Mint State) addresses those coins that are "free from any trace of wear", hence Uncirculated coins and/or better. What started out strictly for large cents was adopted by the rest of the numismatic community for ALL coins. For instance, a MS63 coin would be called Choice Uncirculated whereas a Gem Uncirculated would be listed as MS65. A Gem Uncirculated Plus may be a MS67 grade. All in all, there are a lot of "grades" between your standard VF and EF and quantitatively using numbers instead of terms is more accurate than none at all. Here is more good reading: http://ngccoin.com/about/history.asp Here's a breakdown: MS-70. The perfect coin. Has very attractive sharp strike and original luster of the highest quality for the date and mint. No contact marks are visible under magnification. There are absolutely no hairlines, scuff marks or defects. Attractive and outstanding eye appeal. Copper coins must be bright with full original color and luster. MS-69. Must have very attractive sharp strike and full original luster for the date and mint, with no more than two small non-detracting contact marks or flaws. No hairlines or scuff marks can be seen. Has exceptional eye appeal. Copper coins must be bright with full original color and luster. MS-68. Attractive sharp strike and full original luster for the date and mint, with no more than four light scattered contact marks or flaws. No hairlines or scuff marks show. Exceptional eye appeal. Copper coins must have original color. MS-67. Has full original luster and sharp strike for date and mint. May have three or four very small contact marks and one more noticeable but not detracting mark. On comparable coins, one or two small single hairlines may show under magnification, or one or two partially hidden scuff marks or flaws may be present. Eye appeal is exceptional. Copper coins have lustrous original color. MS-66. Must have above average quality of strike and full original mint luster, with no more than two or three minor but noticeable contact marks. A few very light hairlines may show under magnification, or there may be one or two light scuff marks showing of frosted surfaces or in the field. The eye appeal must be above average and very pleasing for the date and mint. Copper coins display full original or lightly toned color as designated. MS-65. Shows an attractive high quality of luster and strike for the date and mint. A few small scattered contact marks, or two larger marks may be present, and one or two small patches of hairlines may show under magnification. Noticeable light scuff marks may show on the high points of the design. Overall quality is above average and overall eye appeal is very pleasing. Copper coins have full luster with original or darkened color as designated. MS-64. Has at least average luster and strike for the type. Several small contact marks in groups, as well as one or two moderately heavy marks may be present. One or two small patches of hairlines may show under magnification. Noticeable light scuff marks or defects might be seen within the design or in the field. Attractive overall quality with a pleasing eye appeal. Copper coins may be slightly dull. Color should be designated. MS-63. Mint luster may be slightly impaired. Numerous small contact marks, and a few scattered heavy marks may be seen. Small hairlines are visible without magnification. Several detracting scuff marks or defects may be present throughout the design or in the fields. The general quality is about average, but overall the coin is rather attractive. Copper pieces may be darkened or dull. Color should be designated. MS-62. An impaired or dull luster may be evident. Clusters of small marks may be present throughout with a few large marks or nicks in prime focal areas. Hairlines may be very noticeable. Large unattractive scuff marks might be seen on major features. The strike, rim and planchet quality may be noticeably below average. Overall eye appeal is generally acceptable. Copper coins will show a diminished color and tone. MS-61. Mint luster may be diminished or noticeably impaired, and the surface has clusters of large and small contact marks throughout. Hairlines could be very noticeable. Scuff marks may show as unattractive patches on large areas or major features. Small rim nicks, striking or planchet defects may show, and the quality may be noticeably poor. Eye appeal is somewhat unattractive. Copper pieces will be generally dull dark and possibly spotted. MS-60. Unattractive, dull or washed out mint luster may mark this coin. There may be many large detracting contact marks, or damage spots, but absolutely no trace of wear. There could be a heavy concentration of hairlines, or unattractive large areas of scuff marks. Rim nicks may be present, and eye appeal is very poor. Copper coins may be dark, dull and spotted.
the uk uses the same as the op says the reason i think its better is it removes that personal opinion from the equation. if anyone has ever read coin collecters survival manual by travers, in it he did an experiment with 100 coin dealers, there grading was all over the place. i believe that 1-70 grading system is too subjective as a basis to coin grading. 7 grades is enough,its also removes the subjectivity as proven in travers book. I also believe that the people that perpetrate the 1-70 grading system are the grading companies they have most to gain from a subjective system of grading.using the 7 grading standards then valuing within that as high or low end grade within it, is something any collector or dealer can learn. There would be no need to send any coins at all to be slabbed if this system was used.it was good enough for 100s of years.There would be no need for all the constant submitting to slabbing companies which is eating a lot of money out of the coin buisness for themselves with nothing of value giving in return. Its a big old con of the highest order.ANA joins in this con as well, half the people that join ANA only do so to gain access to the high end grading companies to slab, as any one can join ANA anyway why make joining them a pre-requisite to sending coins off for grading.In return ANA promotes a couple of companies above others and the 1-70 grading system. A nice cosy monopoly
I agree with Highlander. Seven grades are enough, Give a plus and a minus, or an A or G before and after the grades, you then have enough flexibility to pinpoint an accurate grade without the problem of a profit orientated grading system as per the 70 points. For example in the UK a coin dealer has two modern mint state coins, a US grader comes along and grades them MS63 and MS65 respectively. The prices for each are different. A UK dealer would just call them both UNC and sell them at the same price. Thus you can pick up the nicest UNC coins by cherry-picking and not having to pay any extra for the priveledge. Wonderful.
As long as yours truly can buy a VF35 coin at VF20 pricing or an AU58 coin at AU50 pricing, or a MS63 speciman at MS61 pricing I am all for it. But if I am selling that VF35 coin, I would want VF35 pricing and NOT VF20 market values and so forth in the above example. So ther you have it, when I buy coins, I will adopt F versus VF versus EF, etc. But if I sell and my coin is a borderline EF to AU...gimme Sheldon's numbers!
Hmmmm - 7 grades, each one having an A or G before & after. Now unless I'm mistaken - that makes a total of 21 grades. Here in the US we use a total of 24 - somehow that doesn't seem all that different to me Where many get confused in thinking there is a large difference is that they think the Sheldon system uses 70 different grade numbers - they do not. For the most part, with very rare exceptions, there are only 24 grades used. And yes that counts all 11 MS grades. If what you are saying was true - it would be a great idea. Unfortunately - it isn't. I have bought quite a few unc coins from European dealers, including some in the UK - and trust me - not all unc coins are priced equally. European dealers are just as discriminating price wise as US dealers.
Let me give you real-world example. When I purchase gasoline, I don't fall for the marketing hype. SU2000+ gas means nothing to me. 93 octane does. Call it what you will, but I want the quantitative grade, NOT somebody's slick use of adjectives. 87, 88, 89, 91, 93, 94 octane levels are all sold here in the states and many of the oil companies love to call their "grades" many names. I don't care what they call it...just give me the octane number and how much it cost...than I will make my decision as to what to buy. I use to work in the precioius metal industry and terms like "precious" versus "semi-precious" were bantered around until the insurance industry (for medical and dental purposes) quantified descriptions so that no confusion existed. After all, their reasoning was semi-precious doesn't make sense...it is or it is not! Back to coin grading. For me, I want the numbers because I know a 64 is better than a 63. How easy is that! Choice versus Gem B.U., or A.U. versus A.U. plus versus A.U./B.U. sometime drives me crazy. After all, there is a bunch of room to negotiate and instead of plus's or whatever...give me the freakin' Sheldon number and life will be good!
I just don't understand why some people believe that the Sheldon scale is some form of a racket courtesy of the grading companies. After all, Dr. Sheldon started this type of grading almost 40 years BEFORE PCGS slabbed their first coin!
Grading I'm with you I collect Australian coins and the Aussies use the same grading as the Kiwis. It makes buting simple but when I buy coins here in the states the prices are all over the board. KISS Keep it simple
