John Lackland - the rotten king of England

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by TheRed, Oct 25, 2017.

  1. TheRed

    TheRed Well-Known Member

    "Foul as it is, hell itself is made fouler by the presence of King John." - Matthew of Paris c.1230

    So was the judgment of John as written by Matthew of Paris, an English Benedictine monk and chronicler, artist, and cartographer, who wrote in the mid-13th century. Even today, 801 years after his death, John Lackland is thought of as a cruel and greedy tyrant. Many historians have argued that he is the "worst" king in English history.

    When Richard died in 1199 of a gangrenous wound inflicted by a crossbow, John was crowned king of England. In a roughly five year period John lost Normandy, Anjou, Maine, Brittany, and Poitou, thus bringing an end to the Angevin empire of his father. During these wars he would have his nephew, Arthur Duke of Brittany, murdered. He would also spend vast sums of money trying to regain the lost territories, and to acquire those sums he bled England white. He sold royal appointments, charters, and plans for new towns and instituted a feudal military service tax eleven times in seventeen years. The Jewish community of England was also heavily taxed, as were inheritances. Income and moveable goods were taxed starting in 1207 while fines, court fees, and confiscations were also increased. Noble widows wishing to remain single had to pay a fee. It has been claimed that as much as 1/3 of the coinage in England resided in the royal coffer.

    Such policies, coupled with continued military failures in France, lead to a period of severe deflation, general economic hardship, and eventually an open defiance of the king and revolt by northern barons in 1215. The rebel barons marched on London in the spring of that year, and eventually met with John near London in June. At Runnymede John and the barons, in an attempt to come to a peace agreement, created a charter, later known as the Magna Carta, which outlined the rights of free men. These rights included swift justice, taxation only with consent, and protection from illegal imprisonment. Despite agreeing to the charter, John would appeal to Pope Innocent III who in turn excommunicated the rebel barons and declared the charter illegal. The result was the First Baron's War, which lasted the rest of John's reign and saw his fortunes rise and fall repeatedly. Prince Louis of France even invaded upon invitation of the barons and was declared king of England at St. Paul's Cathedral. John died in 1216 and his son, Henry III, would include the Magana Carta in the treaty that ended the war in 1217.

    John AR Penny .jpg
    John I AR Short Cross Penny 1205 AD Canterbury mint; Arnaud moneyer; struck in the name of Henry II.
    18mm 1.51g
    Obv: Crowned head facing; scepter to left; HENRICVSR EX
    Rev: Voided short cross; quatrefoil in each angle; +ARNAVD*ON*CANT
    SCBC 1351; North 970

    Feel free to post any medieval coins or coins of rulers with abysmal reputations.
     
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  3. Sallent

    Sallent Live long and prosper

    I can see the resemblance to Disney's version. LOL.

    Princejohn07.jpg
     
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  4. Orfew

    Orfew Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus

    Excellent post @TheRed I really enjoyed it. I love your coin of John. I have been looking for one of those for my own collection. There are plenty of them but I just have not seen the right one...yet.

    Here is my current favourite mediaeval coin. A denier of Eleanor of Aquitaine.

    Eleanor of Aquitaine (1137-1204)
    Anglo-Gallic Aquitaine
    Denier
    (17.93 mm 0.69 g 12h)
    12h (E 11; W 9; S 8011
    Obv: two cross patt‚e divided by a pellet, m above, a below, +dvcis it,
    Rev. +aqvitanie, cross patte
    Dix Noonan Webb Online Auction September 13, 2017 Lot 163

    Eleanor.jpg
     
  5. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    Very Kool coin and write up. The Magna Carta..very important piece of history.
     
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  6. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE

    LOL, Mommy, Dearest!!!
     
  7. Orfew

    Orfew Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus

    LOL I wondered how long it would take someone to say something like that. You never disappoint Brian.:)
     
  8. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    Great example, I like the toning on it.

    He's on my want list too.
     
  9. TheRed

    TheRed Well-Known Member

    I love the Disney version of Robin Hood, probably because it was always on the TV when my father was tasked with watching the kids. The movie did a great job portraying John.
    tumblr_n7g49xijty1s2wio8o1_500-1.gif
     
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  10. TheRed

    TheRed Well-Known Member

    Great Eleanor denier @Orfew your coin is a real gem. That was a great score from Dix Noonan. I really want to get an Eleanor denier, it is currently top five on my want list.

    Thanks @ominus1 and @Mat
    I would watch CNG, they will usually have a few pennies of his in their electronic auctions. John was a prodigious minter of coins.
     
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  11. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    It's usually ebay for me, I see there is several at any given time.:cool:
     
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  12. Orfew

    Orfew Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus

    Thanks @TheRed
    I really wanted that coin. I had to buy 5 coins in a lot in order to get the Eleanor. The interesting thing is that if I sold the other four, they would very easily pay for the whole lot. It would be almost like getting the Eleanor for free. However, I really liked the other four and will keep them. Two of them are Anglo-Gallic deniers of Edward I, and the other 2 are Anglo-Gallic deniers of Richard I, another son of Eleanor. Turns out I bought an interesting group of Anglo-Gallic deniers and they are now a part of my small collection of mediaeval coins.

    I hope you find one for yourself soon. When you see one...grab it. they do not seem to last very long when they do come up for sale.
     
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  13. Multatuli

    Multatuli Homo numismaticus

    Great thread and great coins!!
    Here one of my evil kings:
    Spain (Leon and Castille)
    Pedro el Cruel (Peter the Cruel) 1350-1369
    AR Half Real, Sevilla. 1.76g.
    Ref: AB374.1 R1
    Ex-Archer Huntington (HSA 26909)
    659C903B-4555-4D4B-8C1E-6CE9792800DE.jpeg 7EA16DAC-3761-4ED2-B5F9-6B8292C43E5D.jpeg
     
  14. TheRed

    TheRed Well-Known Member

    Great coin @Multatuli
    Pedro is a really fascinating figure. He was supported by Edward of Woodstock in his war against Aragon and the French. When Pedro wad murdered it bankrupted Edward and caused him to raise taxes and exploit the people of Aquitaine.
     
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  15. Orfew

    Orfew Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus

    Speaking of Edward of Woodstock...

    edward black Prince.jpg

    Anglo-Gallic. Aquitaine: Edward the Black Prince. 1362-72.
    (20.16 mm 0.96 g)
    Hardi d'argent of Poitiers
    (.96g 20.16 mm).
    Half-length figure of the Prince/Long cross divides legend. Elias 205b, S 8143. aVF, natural split on reverse.
    Ex S. George Tucker, sold by Owl (the late John Barton) 10/81, #154$150+
    Ex: William Rosenblum Coins Auction 47A - June 29, 2017 Lot 105
     
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  16. FitzNigel

    FitzNigel Medievalist

    Sorry I'm late to the party - can't wait for a break from work to get back into coining.

    Med-09a-Eng-1205-John-D-5c-London-Walter-1353.jpg
    England
    John, r. 1199-1216 (1205-1216)
    London Mint, AR Short Cross Penny, 18.12mm x 1.54 grams
    Obv.: hENRICVS RE[X]. Bust facing crowned with sceptre, curls enclose pellets
    Rev.: + WALTER . ON . LV. Short cross voided with quatrefoil in each angle
    Ref.: North 971, SCBC 1353, CC99 JH1D-020, De Wit 3196
    Ex. Dr. Murray Gell-Mann Collection
     
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  17. Multatuli

    Multatuli Homo numismaticus

    Impressive a sua there was already “globalization” at that time! Lol
    My apologies for the poor quality of the pics...
     
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