My first auction - have my coins been done justice?

I told them that both the Vitellius Sestertius and the Otacilia Severa Medallion (1000 years aniversary of Rome) are casts but they didn´t even bother including any info on the latter :-(.

Funny enough, Aureo & Calico went ahead with selling an identical copy of my coin despite me telling them that both must be fakes. Theirs went to sell for 2.500 Euros / 3.000 USD (not including fees). That makes mine a bargain, I guess

https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=1672&lot=1065

Here is my Medallion (a very interesting type nevertheless) which was also sold as genuine in the first place, but the seller later gave me a refund for it...





The Vitellius is not bad for a modern Paduan either, I would say:

 

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I never like to see any CoinTalk Ancients Forum members getting treated disrespectfully when it comes to selling any of their coins. I guess it's because I think of many of you as personal friends even though I likely will never meet any of you face to face.

As far as your significant other's attitude toward your collection is concerned—what if you were to tell her that your collection is a very valuable investment and that she will likely (possibly ) inherit it someday?

 

This is far too broad a statement. It depends what segment of the market you're talking about. Yes, relatively few modestly priced ancient coins are sold via printed catalogues these days (though still more than you suggest.) Most truly choice and/or expensive coins however are sold either at public auction with printed catalogues or via private treaty; not too many are offered in strictly e-auctions. Yes, if you simply tally the absolute number of coins that change hands your claim is doubtless correct. If however you consider the total expenditure in US dollars or Swiss francs or euros or pounds--surely at least as valid a way to evaluate the market as a brute-force count of coins--the picture changes. I haven't attempted to run the numbers so I can't "prove" my claim, but I'm confident that money is still being spent largely at public auction with printed catalogues. Not to belabor the obvious, but one $10,000 coin= one hundred $100 coins.

Phil Davis

 

Doug and lrbguy have hinted at the elephant in the room here, so I'll just come out and say it: these coins are completely undesirable to most of the market. They are damaged, corroded, lacking patinas, and there are a couple of copies thrown in to boot. I wouldn't touch this lot with a ten foot pole, and neither would 99% of bidders. The auction house knows very well that neither you nor they are going to make any money on this bunch, so they spent the minimal amount of time listing it. They kept them in the flips because they don't want their customers to have a good look at them, which is a piss-poor business tactic if you ask me, but that's the strategy in any case.

There are many reasons to collect problem coins - a coin can captivate a collector for historical and numismatic reasons despite its lack of beauty. I should know - I collect Nabataean issues, some of which are the most poorly-struck, poorly-preserved and expensive of rarities. (If my wife knew what I spent on some of those coins, I'd surely be looking at divorce papers.) But one should never expect any sort of equitable market return on problem coins, regardless of their numismatic interest - unless they're great rarities of course, which is a different ballgame.

Almost all collectors of bronze are looking for attractive patinas. There is nothing wrong with preferring brassy "naked" coins. If that's what you like, that's what you like, each to his own! But be aware that most collectors reject this look. They find it ugly, and naked brass is also far more prone to bronze disease than coins with patinas. I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news - I'm not one to judge anyone's collecting aesthetics, and this is only one man's opinion. But if selling your coins is part of your decision-making process in buying them, you need to understand that problem coins are, well...a problem. I wish you the best with your sales.

 

I suppose you can count me in the 1% then because I like the OP coins just fine (minus the inauthentic ones). Maybe these are not desirable to a certain segment of the market but a quick search through stuff actually selling on eBay shows plenty of people are willing to spend a great deal on coins that are much less desirable than the OP offerings IMO. Perhaps what you're suggesting is that the venue chosen is not the best venue to reach this segment of collectors? With that I agree. However...

The auction house was under no obligation to accept the coins on consignment. When they agreed to do so it became a matter of professional decency that they should present the offerings in thier auction in a manner that shows that they actually care about their profession. Whether they make money or not the lack of care given in this case is an insult to thier customers, consigners and colleagues.

 

Good points! I agree with them both. Like I said, I'm not passing a value judgment on the collection of patina-less coins, just pointing out that most collectors of bronze prefer patinas (and problem-free coins). And you are absolutely correct about the lack of professionalism on the part of the auction house. If they accept a lot for sale, they need to treat it with respect - or not accept it at all!

 

That's a nice thought, but in view of the consignor's "hindsight" let me suggest that you might not want to be the first person to bid on the lot. I think he said that the start bid is pegged at about 1/3 of what he has into the lot. If there is a chance for it to go unsold, let it, so he can sell the material in an appropriate venue that treats it more advantageously. If it already has pre-bids on it, then ignore my comments here, because as soon as one bid comes in, others need to jump on the bandwagon. But if nothing so far, then it would mean "no" to pre-bids and "yes" to live participation, holding off until a bid comes in.

 

Professionalism and respect for the coins is what really sets venues apart for me. I would much rather buy from someone who seems to care about the coins they sell (not to mention respect for thier customers). This is why I always enjoy your auctions JA. Even when I'm not in the market for the specific types on offer I often learn something new and of course your own professionalism is beyond reproach.

 

Well said, John!

 

Yes, it was a broad statement. Sometimes I only have a little time to make a comment and I dont convey my full thoughts. Essentially, the vast majority of coins (quantity wise) are now sold digitally. Modestly priced coins are rarely put into print. I have not received a print catalog of such priced coins in probably 10 years. But of course we all know there is a smaller segment of the market in which coins are placed into print. And yes, I understand those fewer quantity of coins represent the largest quantity of monetary value.

Agreed. I too like coins with brassy tan patinas, or with brassy highlights showing through the patina. I dont consider them to be problems at all, but that is what I like and when I buy them I am only thinking about what I like and not what others do. If I can get them cheaper as a result, all the better!

 

@Julius Germanicus good luck with your first auction.
I went to the Auktionshaus Felzmann web site and they have good pictures of your coins - obverse and reverse. Sixbid and Numisbid pictures are still the ones in plastic. I bought one coin from AF. I received the coin before the bill! I think of them as a stamp company that has coins at times.
https://auktionen.felzmann.de/Auktion/Onlinekatalog?intAuktionsId=512

I think the lot should have been removed from the flips for bidders to have a chance to see what they are buying. One of my rules for buying a coin on line is the web site must have pictures. No picture, no bid from me.

"I told them that both the Vitellius Sestertius and the Otacilia Severa Medallion (1000 years aniversary of Rome) are casts"

I think it is even worse for you to tell them there are two cast copies of coins and them tell potential bidders about one. Maybe the pictures tell all you need to say.

 

Thanks for looking it up! That is much better, even though would have been preferable if they had updated the Sixbid and Numisbid pictures as well. Also it would have been good if they had at least named the Emperors because as it is the lot will not show up in any search (if you look for "Nero" on those two engines it will not show of course).

They do include individual coins with a minimum bid of as little as 32 Euros in their sale (with proper photos and description!). Leu, on the other hand, starts at 200 USD of course and does not even include bundles.

I liked all those coins - at least I found them sufficient for my my first portrait gallery when I was a beginner two years ago. Had I imagined they would become surplus one day, I would not have bought them in the first place.
But then I got carried away and upgraded them instead of obeying my self imposed restrictions
From a financial perspective it makes more sense to buy one truely great Sestertius instead of ten mediocre ones of different emperors, but I guess that is a phase most new collectors have been through.

 

Thank you for the kind words - you make me feel a little better already

 

I think Sixbid and Numisbid would have to reload the auction to show the updated photos. You might email them and request that. They may not do it, but it's worth a try.

 

As I expected nobody bid for the lot .

But my other coin (Galba Sestertius) that was presented in the right way in the same auction DID find a new home and sell for a little more than twice the minimum bid (and a lot more than what I paid for it), so my first auction WAS a little success after all .

As the auction house has shown that they CAN do it if they want, I´ll give them a chance to offer the other coins appropriately in their next auction or otherwise sell them myself via eBay or whatever.