1744 1/2C identification help

Discussion in 'World Coins' started by Mark Metzger, Aug 7, 2017.

  1. Mark Metzger

    Mark Metzger Well-Known Member

    Any help with this coin would be appreciated:

    IMG_3261.JPG IMG_3260.JPG
     
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  3. Kentucky

    Kentucky Supporter! Supporter

    Very crude strike, will be interested to see if anyone knows something about it.
     
  4. Mark Metzger

    Mark Metzger Well-Known Member

    I agree. For 1744 it looks very rudely struck given the sophistication of its contemporaries. Possibly a colonial piece struck on site in the hinterlands?
     
  5. Kentucky

    Kentucky Supporter! Supporter

    BTW, is this copper?
     
  6. Numismat

    Numismat World coin enthusiast

    It's possible the date is 1544. At that time the numeral 5 could still have been represented in the medieval form, which looks like a modern 7.
     
    George McClellan likes this.
  7. Johndoe2000$

    Johndoe2000$ Well-Known Member

    The first numeral doesn't look like a modern either, so I'd say you're onto something.
     
  8. PaddyB

    PaddyB Eccentric enthusiast

    I don't have my books to hand at the moment but it looks Indian Subcontinent colonial to me - possibly Goa? This was a Portuguese colony and so the combination of Western and Indian symbology would fit.
     
    George McClellan likes this.
  9. Numismat

    Numismat World coin enthusiast

    I was thinking it has a look vaguely reminiscent of small cash coins struck in Danish India. Also, it appears to have a motif with three small hearts on the second side. Hearts can be seen on some Danish colonial coins from India and the West Indies. The lack of a crowned monogram pretty much rules that out though, at least as far as officially issued coins go.
     
    George McClellan likes this.
  10. Mark Metzger

    Mark Metzger Well-Known Member

    Great leads but they are all coming up empty on Numista (great images over there). Any thoughts on whether the letter after the 1/2 might be an 'r' rather than a 'c'? That would rule in 1/2 rupees and reis instead of cash and cents.
    I'm fully invested in this search now!
     
  11. PaddyB

    PaddyB Eccentric enthusiast

    If Goa doesn't come up with anything, try Sri Lanka/Ceylon? The Portuguese and Dutch were there before the British and it reminds me of some of the early colonial stuff there...
     
  12. Numismat

    Numismat World coin enthusiast

    Mark, it would be really helpful to know the diameter and weight.

    Pareidolia comes into play with crude stuff like this. Must take into consideration that what you interpret as "1/2 C" may be nothing of that sort at all.
     
    George McClellan likes this.
  13. josemartins

    josemartins Member

    Definetely not Portuguese India. It does look like an english (scottish ?) communion token of that era (18th century).

    Quick google search of parishes that have three crescents in their crest: Sedgefield, Pitsford, Hungerford, Milton Malzor and Holcot.

    Minister: C.G. (???), or the letters on the reverse (?)

    Jose
     
    Numismat likes this.
  14. Mark Metzger

    Mark Metzger Well-Known Member

    Not sure if the weight but it is roughly 18mm.
    image.jpg image.jpg
     
    PaddyB likes this.
  15. HannyPlays

    HannyPlays New Member

    lordmarcovan likes this.
  16. HannyPlays

    HannyPlays New Member

  17. Numismat

    Numismat World coin enthusiast

    @josemartins is right I believe. I'm not that familiar with communion tokens, but now that he mentioned it, this piece really does fit with that.
     
  18. lehmansterms

    lehmansterms Many view intelligence as a hideous deformity

    Out of an irrational fear that "satanists" might contrive to hide a piece of the communion host (bread) and smuggle it out of the church for use in the "unholy", satanic rituals, communion tokens were distributed to those who could be trusted not to be witches or warlocks - after all, they were still burning or hanging poverty-stricken and marginalized men and women as witches in the hinterlands in the mid 18th century.
    While it might well be a Scottish communion token, the other thing I thought of when I saw it was a plantation token. This is somewhat like the colonial enclave coinages of imperialist European corporations - created for use within a relatively small community - and to serve as a private fiat money rather than allowing the "peasants" to have real, precious metal coins they might spend outside the confines of the economic area. This is also somewhat like the corporate token coinages that were common in coal-mining "towns" which were entities wholly-owned by the corporate interests. Workers were paid in company money which was only good to spend at the company store, etc.
     
  19. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan 48-year collector Moderator

    I agree more with the "European colony somewhere around India" theory than the "Scottish communion token" theory, though some kind of plantation token is certainly a possibility. (I suppose a communion token is not totally out of the question, either - I really don't know - but all of the Scottish ones I've seen were much more sophisticated than that.) It's definitely got a "colonial" vibe, though what colony I cannot say.

    It certainly is not medieval nor pre-medieval. That's a 1744 date for sure. The numeral "1" is consistent with 17th and 18th century style.

    Don't you just love the intriguing oldies like this in a good bulk lot? :)
     
    Oxford Punter likes this.
  20. Nas

    Nas Well-Known Member

    at first i thought arabic number which 8699 - ٨٦٩٩ or 1699 - ١٦٩٩.
    but i have seen that pattern before . but dont remmber where :bored: . you still have nice coins
     
  21. Mark Metzger

    Mark Metzger Well-Known Member

    Here's an update on this mysterious piece...though not much progress at all. I got in touch with a gentleman named David Stewart of ABC Coins and Tokens in Northumberland, England looking for insight. His site lists countless communion tokens so I figured he'd be able to help...alas, he couldn't. His response was "I've looked through all my catalogues and drawn a blank. While the date side looks like a communion token, the "shield" side is very uncharacteristic."
    So here we are, back where we started.
    The truth is out there...
     
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