Science Fair

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by hamman88, Sep 19, 2007.

  1. hamman88

    hamman88 Spare some change, sir?

    My science teacher told us today about the upcoming science fair, normally we would be required to do it as a part of class, but we don't have time because it is technically a college class. So for once it is optional, and being the nerd I am, I want to do it. So I got to thinking, what can I do that I'm interested in and has a practical application, COINS!! What kind of questions do you guys have about coins that would like to find out that would involve science? If you don't have any questions, you could also suggest good ideas.


    BTW, last time I made it to the tri-county competition. I lost to the guy who I though at the worth project.
     
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  3. modest9797

    modest9797 Member

    I too am doing a science fair project. I was thinking of doing a test on what liquid/product cleans (gasp!) coins the best. But my teacher said it wasn't up to my grade level. Sooo, I am doing something different. I thought about coin realated topics and haven't thought of any others.
     
  4. rickyb

    rickyb With a name like Ricky...

    do a nicadate and buffalo thing
     
  5. hamman88

    hamman88 Spare some change, sir?

    nice, involves acid and metal density.
     
  6. Speedy

    Speedy Researching Coins Supporter

    I would ask her why?......that doesn't make "cents"

    Speedy
     
  7. hontonai

    hontonai Registered Contrarian

    A specific gravity test platform could be put together, with information on the sg's of coin silver (.900), sterling (.925), and various other commonly used silver and gold alloys; perhaps with something on zinc and copper as well.

    Hopefully that would have enough real world adult practical application to satisfy your teacher.
     
  8. hamman88

    hamman88 Spare some change, sir?

    ooo, or maybe a cent substitute
     
  9. toddestan

    toddestan New Member

    You could do a project on how vending machines use the electromagnetic signature to detect the various coins. If you could manage to build a device that can identify coins using that method, that would be really cool (I have no idea how complex they actually are). Alternatively, you could also do the project on mechanical sorting, though that would be less "sciencey" if you ask me.
     
  10. hamman88

    hamman88 Spare some change, sir?

    Intersting, but we have to test something. I could tset how to beat the machine, but I think thats illegal.
     
  11. kanga

    kanga 65 Year Collector

    A good Science Fair project has several broad parts:
    -- Problem
    -- Investigation/Experimentation
    -- Analysis
    -- Conclusion

    PROBLEM: How does acid affect coins
    EXPERIMENT: Drop coins into acid
    ANALYSIS: Coins sort of dissolve and get smaller
    CONCLUSION: Acid and coins don’t do well together

    The above project would earn you nothing academically.
    What it needs is to be qualified and quantified.
    (And even at the level of detail I’m going to use, this would not be a college level Science Fair project. It is only an example.)

    PROBLEM: How do various acids in various concentrations affect coins

    PRE-PROJECT EXPECTED RESULTS:
    -- Various acids will affect coins differently (one conclusion will be ranking quantitatively their reactivity)
    -- Various concentrations will affect coins differently (higher concentrations will increase the reaction rate - quantify)
    -- [things like that]

    EXPERIMENT: Vary the types, concentrations, exposure times, coin type, etc.
    Keep accurate records and particularly make non-quantifiable observations such as “experiment caused the neighborhood to be evacuated.”
    Which brings up the point, you really need to have a good idea of what to expect if results could be hazardous.

    ANALYSIS: What were the results of the types, concentrations, exposure times, coin types, etc. [charts, graphs, etc.]
    What were the reaction products (gases, solids, etc.)

    CONCLUSION: Acid and coins don’t do well together
    Sources of acid contamination
    Preventive methods
     
  12. hamman88

    hamman88 Spare some change, sir?

    Kanga, were you a scientist?
     
  13. kanga

    kanga 65 Year Collector

    Worse.
    I was a science teacher (but only for 7 years.)
    9th grade Earth Science
     
  14. hamman88

    hamman88 Spare some change, sir?

    Any science fair ideas using electroysis and coins?
     
  15. kanga

    kanga 65 Year Collector

    No, not right off hand.
    Electrolysis is generally used to separate things (water into hydrogen and oxygen is a common example.)
    The only use of metal there would be in the electrodes (+ and -).

    And "plating" metal, although the electrical setup is similar, is a different process.

    Google "electrolysis" and start with the Wikipedia entry.
    That may give you some ideas.
     
  16. hamman88

    hamman88 Spare some change, sir?

    Sorry, I meant electro-stripping. I even have the machine and beakers and all that stuff.
     
  17. gatzdon

    gatzdon Numismatist

    Don't know how easy it would be for OP to make up slugs of copper nickel, but the materials are readily available (nickels, pennies, older canadian nickels, etc...)

    The anticounterfeiting experiment with vending machines is college level, but partially solved 40 years ago.

    The solution was to generate bimetal laminated coins whose electromagnetic signature is not easily duplicated. A slug with exact same copper-nickel composition (but homogenous) would not fool a vending machine. One can buy electronic coin validator's for less than $100 brand new (I'm assuming used would be cheaper). The hands on part would be showing that a coin validator that accepts the legitamit bi-metal coin, but still rejects the slug despite it having the exact same amount of copper/nickel.

    There are token manufacturers that have taken the anti-counterfeiting measures to greater levels, but their technology is primarily used in more expensive tokens like $5 car wash tokens.
     
  18. kanga

    kanga 65 Year Collector

    Not familiar with electro-stripping.
    I'd still use Google to look for ideas.
    See if you can figure out where coins could fit in.
    Just keep in mind the parts of a Science Fair project that I outlined before.
     
  19. alwayslost

    alwayslost New Member

    That is a real good suggestion from hontonai from a science standpoint. Not only does it take into account your love of coins it also gets the attention of the science teacher. I would make it interesting and at the start explain about Archimedes in ancient greece who had the task of determining if a kings crown was made of real or fake gold.

    For example, if you had a unc copper penny and a new penny made from different metals, you could make a little boat and put the copper penny in the little boat and measure how much water it displaces. You could then take a new alloy penny and do the same and see that the amount of water displaced is not the same showing the relative density differences.

    Since it would be hard to measure the displacement of one penny you could use ten and then the amount of water displaced would be easily measureable in a small container filled with water. The more pennies used the more accurate your measurement.
     
  20. Brennn10

    Brennn10 Coins =

  21. alwayslost

    alwayslost New Member

    The nickel copper battery should work due to the valances. Copper has a valence of 1 or 2 and Nickel has a valence of 0 or 1 or 2 or 3 or 4. All it takes is a difference in the valances and then there is electron flow but I only know classical physics. New physics would call it deceleration.
     
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