What would you grade this 1921-S Raw Morgan?

So I just came across this absolutely gorgeous 1921-S Morgan at my favorite local B&M. It was a raw example, which I look at everyone he gets in, but almost never pull the trigger on. This one just spoke to me and the price was like an offer from the "God Father", I just couldn't refuse. Now these beasts are a different breed when it comes to grading them. I'd put it at a 64 in my opinion. Both the obverse and reverse are dripping with luster and the obverse is full of die polishing lines that made it look cleaned on first inspection. What would you guys say?

@Cascade, @SuperDave, @heavycam.monstervam, @Dave Waterstraat, @messydesk you guys seem to be the '21 guru's around here. Also, I can't seem to match the VAM on this one using the polished obverse die guide on VAMWorld. So if you can help out with that, I would greatly appreciate that.

 

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I am in at 64 maybe a plus, the weak strike holds it back some, but very attractive!

 

Nice luster for a 21s....enough luster to get rid of the improperly rinsed dip residue leftover...enough luster left to look very good afterward IMHO

 

I would have thought AU for a few reasons.

 

That's going to need a quick dip and a proper rinse to fix the improper rinse after the last dip it had. Quite lustrous, horrible detail from mashed dies, but that's typical. Lots of polishing lines on the obverse, and possibly a clash strong enough to aid with attribution by the neck. I'd say 58 or 63, but I can't get a really good read on the tip of the bust, which is usually where I look first for broken luster.

 

I'll give it a conservation and re-image it.

 

Yeah I have to say 58 to 63 also neat coin just hard to read.

 

That circular rim die polishing around the edge is a quite unique pattern. I don't think I've seen it before

 

My guy says AU. Too much luster seems to be missing from the devices.

Same. They caught my eye, but it was pretty apparent they were die polish.

 

I gotsta leave for Badger land in 2 hours, otherwise i would atleast TRY to identify vam,
i must like that coin better than the others because i feel it could get a 65 if you successfully removed the brown residue. Otherewise, its just a 64....

21 S are always weak and as such are a whole different animal 2 grade

 

Die crack, "A" to "M" in AMERICA ? 62.

 

I think this one is a bit difficult to grade. It seems to be fairly mark free-something I associate with an MS 65. However, there also appears to be some wear (around the ear and cheek), which might make it an AU 58. I had a Morgan (not a 1921) that was quite lustrous and seemed like a 64 that came back as a 58 from Anacs. Maybe that is the case here. I hope not and that you can get a 64 or 65! Either way, it's still a very nice coin.

 

Slider Unc

 

The marks and shadows around the stars tell me cleaned...AU details.

 

Those marks are die polish lines

 

AU58 Altered surfaces

 

Almost always. I bought an posted one a month or so ago that looks like a 21-P until you see the mint mark.

 

Weak strike. I think it is an AU coin. I see no altered surfaces, only the faint wear in the traditional high places. I have had my share of 1921s, just like the "experts,". So I would say AU 58. Doesn't mean that on a good day, a TPG wouldn't call it uncirculated.

 

Here is the coin after conservation. There are 4 spots on the obverse that are distracting. I think it was a dice roll on this one. I might keep it because I think the die polish on the obverse is pretty cool. I just need to try and VAM it now.

Looking at it, it's UNC and not AU. But it does appear to have a bit of environmental damage in the form of the 4 spots I mentioned above.

 

It certainly looks better now! I still don't know what a TPG would say (and those spots are a bit of a distraction).