Pre-GTG: 1858 Type II 3-Cent Silver Piece

I think this has to be the smallest coin in my collection! Anyway, I think I must submit this to NGC to protect this extremely thin piece better than my Quadrums can.

What do you think it will grade as? There's a clear hit at the center of the star / shield, and there's some wear throughout but the strike is decently sharp. So, I think that MS is out of the question... but I don't know too much about this series of coins. A lot of the examples I see on the 'Bay are in really poor condition, probably because of how small it is, how often it's been used in circulation, and the age of the 3-cent series.

It was a bit difficult to take pics of this tiny coin, so bear with me. I took photos from many different angles and I added a secondary light source with an LED flashlight, but that made the colors appear inaccurately washed-out. The angled photos help to show the true colors of the coin. Anyway, here are the photos below.

Thanks in advance!

 

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I'll go with AU. I like the coin.

 

I like it at around EF-40.

 

I'll go with XF 45 (but I wouldn't be shocked to see an AU grade).

 

And, is this a die clash with the horizontal shields showing between the "III"? The "III" device would be an incuse on the die, so the shield should only clash with the fields between the "III", right? Those horizontal marks I believe are positioned directly opposite the shield's horizontal devices.

There's a die crack near the top serif of the large "C", too.

This pic was taken through the plastic flip so that I don't inadvertently scratch the coin, so you may see some scratches that aren't actually on the coin (e.g. the blurry scratch running diagonally across the "III" is on the plastic flip).

 

Bump - does anyone think it's a die clash error in between the "III" for the reasons stated in the previous post above?

 

It's possible die clashing on these is common.

 

So it's probably not worth paying for the extra Mint Error attribution cost, right? I always try to upgrade my coins whenever I can, so maybe it'll be worth it, not sure.

Btw, I just saw this one on the 'Bay and it has the same type of die clash between the "III", even though it's a different year. So I think it's definitely a die clash, and common as you say.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/332149911319

 

Can't help you there I have never submitted a coin for error attribution.

 

The clash adds nothing to the value of the coin. Don't waste you money.

 

Nice coin. Not sure why a Quadrum holder wouldn't protect a silver 3C as good as any other coin...? I'd grade it XF45, too much wear and not enough luster for AU.

 

Nice AU50

 

Xf-45

 

I don't want to handle it and push into place lol. And, it's good to get it graded anyway in case I ever want to upgrade to a better example.

 

I see... small coin, big hands... it's indeed a fragile little thing. Let us know the grade when you get it back!

 

I'm in the AU family, probably AU50 because of the hit.

For circulated grades, I look to the highest points.

On the obverse, it's the five directional changes of the shield outline where they meet the lines from the star points. Each on that shows wear is -1 (0=EF45, 1=EF40, etc.)

On the reverse, it's the objects in the C.

The diamond at K9 is the EF45 marker. If you've ever seen an MS67 or better 3cs, the four planes of the diamond meet at razor sharp angles and a single point. However, much as 3cs are know for clashes, they're also known for weak strikes which don't fill the objects in the C. You see that here at the top bar (K12).

If the diamond tip is flat, then the six orbs (K7-K8 and K10-K11) are the next wear points. EF40, VF35 and VF25. Then the bars at K6 and K12 - VF20.

Also look at the ribbon. If that's worn, you should subtract 1.



If none of these are worn, you're looking at the tiniest rubs on these points for the AU range. For that you need a loupe.

A pick-up point for MS is the C itself - there is actually a outline and a flat surface. But the outline is very thin and with any wear it is gone. You have a little of it on the bottom arm of the c and just a trace on the top arm.

 

XF45 DETAILS Cleaned. Pretty coin!

 

Nice coin. My smallest silver coin is the 1904 Panama 2 1/2 centesimos. Known as the "Panama pill" it holds the title of the smallest coin produced by the U.S. mint, a meager 10mm diameter.

 

Interesting approach. Are those your own grading standards or do the TPGs work this way too? Do you consider remaining luster and would you up/downgrade coins accordingly?

 

You may want to have this 58 attribution for the RPD-002 1858/158 repunched 1 south seen below the serif, 1st repunched 8 south seen below the top, repunched 5 south seen below the top. No markers to use as pups . But this one is spot on for the variety .