Should we wash dirty laundry in public or in private?

This is something that I think about every time I post information about a coin being of dubious authenticity.

Should such a discussion be held in open in the thread in question or in a private discussion with the owner?

Some people who have asked for a private conversation rather than calling the coin out in public whereas I generally call stuff out in public unless otherwise asked to do so as this is the best way to teach others at the same time. I use this as my default behaviour but realise that this might be wrong.

I generally only query a coin when I have good evidence to back it up and try to post the evidence at the same time.

Opinions?

 

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I myself have learned much from the posts where the authenticity of a particular coin is questioned openly and read thoroughly the ensuing threads. As a beginner in ancients I am thankful that these conversations are open for viewing.

 

Because such discussions are so educational for all, I favor we discuss issues of authenticity openly, provided one qualify one's language to meet the quality of the evidence. This can range from "absolutely fake, it's in such-and-such list of known fakes" to "I'm not sure about this; while it might be genuine, X and Y have me concerned."

Ultimately, the decision to buy is up to the seller.

 

I am all for an open discussion as long as it is done tactfully. Private conversations can be done if the victim wants. Over the years, I have learned a lot through such public discussions.

 

I'm always receptive to open comments, especially since it alerted me to three fakes I purchased over the last two years and later returned for refund. Obviously the downside is when a coin is 'suspected' (and publicly stated) of being fake but turns out to be genuine. Yet, as others have mentioned, I think the learning experience is worth any uncertainty.

When this 'issue' was brought up before, I suggested a PM to the owner if a fake was suspected and only a public comment if the poster requested it since a mere photo is not the best way to determine if a coin is genuine or not. Perhaps that is still the best approach ???

 

As much as I dislike the idea of the authenticity of genuine coins being casually called into question with no good basis, I like even less the idea of a fake not being exposed for what it is, especially as CoinTalk is a public forum, and to my mind, one that serves an educational function for many of us. IMHO, knowledgeable members such as yourself do us all a great service when you post your opinions and suspicions publicly.

 

Like everyone else, I have learned from the open discussions; however, perhaps the owner/victim should be consulted first. Being duped into buying a fake can be very embarrassing for some.

I agree 100 percent.

 

In my humble opinion, I rather appreciate open discussions about possible non-genuine coins. I have learned so much from observing these types of conversations.

I think it really just boils down to how it's approached. Some people unfortunately don't handle the threads tactfully. They may be correct in their accusation of a fake coin, and even provide evidence to back them up, but if done in a harsh or overbearing way, it leaves everyone with a bad taste in their mouth.

Some might say "grow some thick skin" or even "suck it up snowflake", but I just don't see any reason to be mean to one another. How hard is it to have a little empathy for the person with the coin. Perhaps starting the conversation with a "I'm sorry to say this, but I think your coin may be a counterfeit. Here's why I think that....".

It's all in the delivery.

 

From what I read from all the above posts, I feel it is fine to make open posts whether a coin is fake or not. However, I firmly believe that it needs to be informative, with respect, with knowledge, with sound basis of why it is a fake, and NOT just a glib opinion.

Personally, I refuse to comment whether a coin is fake or not, as I do NOT consider myself to be qualified nor as an expert. I am a hobbiest. However, I recognize there are folks, such as yourself @maridvnvm (and several others), that are clearly experts and are qualified to post whether a coin is fake or not.

I get very concerned when I see folks post "opinions" or "pile on" comments as to what they "feel". I think it best NOT to comment or have an opinion.

Many people have spent good money, time, research, and happiness in obtaining a coin. Then, they have their efforts shattered with a glib comment that it is "fake" with nothing to back up the statement.

To me, it is more than the delivery: It is giving clear cut facts, examples, history, comparatives, etc. to ensure the correct message whether a coin is fake or not. It is also delivering that message as if it were being delivered to yourself... with decency and tact.

 

I agree with Alegandron. Even as an "expert" I am very cautious about condemning a coin on suspicion. That said, if I saw a coin that was a clear forgery I would do a PM to the person that purchased it and tell them of my doubts only so they could act upon it. Forgeries are a delicate subject.

 

I agree with the comments above about it being good and educational to have an open conversation about authenticity as long as it's within a standard of decency and respect. I have learned a ton from people on here already. Forgery detection is a field I've been actively studying and I think my eye has been much improving over the last few months.

It's funny you bring this up maridvnvm as there was recently a coin posted to a thread that I believe looked off but I decided not to comment on it as several much more knowledgeable members commented on the thread without saying anything. From the photo I thought I could see what looked like raised casting signs on areas that appeared to be worn and the flan looked possibly raised at the edge. Style looked good. I checked some of the forgery databases and didn't find a match so I let it go and assumed I was mistaken. I'm not sure if I did the right thing or not...

I will say that of all the numismatic forums I've read the ancients group here at CT seems by far the friendliest and most helpful to beginners and intermediates I'm not sure why but coin collectors on forums usually come off as snarky and dismissive of beginners. Not so here

 

I agree with @Curtisimo and I think most of the posters on the US side would also agree. There have been a few who wanted to cry FAKE, but they often got jumped into worse than the coin in question.

 

Some of my coins have been questioned as fake in the past (not a lot fortunately), either publicly or by PM.

Apart from the fact of having a potential fake in my trays (no less than a kind of black plague) being very frustrating, I have no problem with the question in itself. As long as, as stated above, the poster is respectful and elaborates their opinion.
I tend to prefer the questioning to be public though, the discussion can then be very educational.

I provide the link below with a discussion I started on Forvm about a coin of mine that had been peremptorily declared fake as a comment in my gallery, with no other evidence than the strong opinion of the poster. I really think the ensuing public discussion has been useful (for me of course, and for others), at least the three or four first messages

http://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=34410.0

Q

 

I have had a couple of coins called out as fake and a good discussion followed. I appreciate it and learn from it. I'm all for public discussion as long as it's productive and we all can learn something from it. I do think it's important to have some evidence if you are sure it's fake. Otherwise it's OK to raise a suspension and point out why.

 

It would take a big chunk of interest out of Coin Talk, if possible fakes was not brought up, so I am all for discussion on the board, although I tend to look at it from a different angle in as much as why would people bother casting/forging coins that are are only worth a few dollars, they would certainly have to produce a lot to make any money and there fore they would start to appear on forgery databases pretty quickly. In my opinion the danger for us coin collectors are the really expensive coins that they don't have to make a lot of to make money just making a few now and again. Example Hadrian gold Aureus and Greek Tets.

 

I just assume that people will always try and screw you and that usually works.

 

I prefer the discussions & counterfeit detection advice in the open forum.

You all are so quick to respond & I am often late to reading the threads. When it has already been said & I have nothing additional to contribute, then I sometimes just send the OP a PM rather than piling-on further condemning a coin. I have often sent the message "I just wanted to let you know that I agree with @abc regarding your new xyz coin. Let me know if I can help further".

 

I honestly feel that a good deal of the reason people on other forums are snarky is that there are many postings that are somewhat ridiculous. Assume there were 20 or 30 posts a day here that had coins with copy prominently stamped into them that 1) the poster asks if it is real and 2) they then want to argue with the other members and impugn their honesty, etc. It would get tiresome soon. OTOH, if someone has something negative to say, it helps to give some reason, even "It just looks 'off' to me."

 

Another reason I think some of the other forums are snarky is that, for some reason, they attract pompous pontificators who are trying to show off their "expertise" on a given subject.

A good way to handle them is ask them how many coins they've posted or what they collect. I can name two who dried up and largely blew away after that question.

 

I can see this point and I'm sure it gets tiring telling people that they aren't going to retire off their damaged or discolored pocket change. However, all of us probably started out ,whether kid or adult, intrigued by a strange coin that led us to ask questions and learn. If our present selves could talk to our past selves I'm sure most of us would consider our own questions ridiculous as well. Showing kindness instead of snark is always the best coarse IMHO.

I only mentioned it earlier because CT in general and the ancients group in particular seem short on snark and long on patience. Which I think is great

...also yes.