how rare?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by sugarfreak404, Dec 12, 2004.

  1. sugarfreak404

    sugarfreak404 New Member

    How rare are 1882-CC Unc. Morgan Dollars?

    not just mintage #'s but opinions would be nice too.

    ~Josh~
     
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  3. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    They are not rare at all really. Large numbers of them are available for sale at any given time.

    Rare is a word that too many people use too often when talking about coins. It means different things to different people - but I could not use it when talking about a coin with thousands or tens of thousands of examples readily available. Some folks think a coin with less than 100 examples is rare. To others - it is less than 10.

    That's why they have developed what they call rarity scales. There are many different rarity scales developed by different people. Some only go up to 4 - some to 8 and others to 20. And each number has a different meaning as to how many examples are known.
     
  4. sylvester

    sylvester New Member

    Best to think of it as a Key or semi-key date rather than rare.

    To me if there's ever more than 10 available anwhee at one (or say more than one being offered by any one seller) then the coin is just scarce.

    If there are only 3 or so available at once (all from different sellers) then it's very scarce.


    If there's just the one on the internet available and everywhere else you've looked there isn't one then it's rare.

    If there's not available outside of an auction room then it's very rare.

    Less than 20 in existance Extremely rare

    Less than 10 highest rarity.

    Less than 5 - museum material

    2 - Unobtainable

    1 - unique.
     
  5. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Here's some examples of some of the better known rarity scales -

    The Sheldon Rarity Scale -

    R-1 Common
    R-2 Not So Common
    R-3 Scarce
    R-4 Very Scarce (population est at 76-200)
    R-5 Rare (31-75)
    R-6 Very Rare (13-30)
    R-7 Extremely rare (4-12)
    R-8 Unique or Nearly So (1,2 or 3)


    The Universal Rarity Scale -

    URS-0 None known
    URS-1 1 known, unique
    URS-2 2 known
    URS-3 3 or 4 known
    URS-4 5 to 8 known
    URS-5 9 to 16 known
    URS-6 17 to 32 known
    URS-7 33 to 64 known
    URS-8 65 to 125 known
    URS-9 126 to 250 known
    URS-10 251 to 500 known
    URS-11 501 to 1,000 known
    URS-12 1,001 to 2,000 known
    URS-13 2,001 to 4,000 known
    URS-14 4,001 to 8,000 known
    URS-15 8,001 to 16,000 known
    URS-16 16,001 to 32,000 known
    URS-17 32,001 to 65,000 known
    URS-18 65,001 to 125,000 known
    URS-19 125,001 to 250,000 known
    URS-20 250,001 to 500,000 known



    GEORGE FULD RARITY SCALE FOR TOKEN COINS

    RARITY ESTIMATED NUMBER IN EXISTENCE
    R - 1 Greater than 5000 (Relatively Common)
    R - 2 2001 to 5000
    R - 3 501 to 2000
    R - 4 201 to 500
    R - 5 76 to 200
    R - 6 21 to 75
    R - 7 11 to 20
    R - 8 5 to 10
    R - 9 2 to 4
    R - 10 1 Only



    This list of rarity scales goes on almost forever. For just about every nation and every time period - there is a rarity scale for the coinage. But the first two are the ones most often used for US coinage.
     
  6. sylvester

    sylvester New Member

    I think us Brits us something similar to the Sheldon scale. I think we go up to R8.

    Certainly nothing as crazy as R20.
     
  7. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Actually Sylvester the Seaby & Rayner book uses 12.

    C3 - Extremely common
    C2 - Very Common
    C - Common
    N - Normal neither scarce nor common
    S - Scarce
    R - Rare
    R2 - Very Rare
    R3 - Extremely Rare
    R4 - Only 11 - 20 examples known
    R5 - Only 5 - 10 examples known
    R6 - Only 3 - 4 examples known
    R7 - Only 1 - 2 examples known


    And I may as well post some others while I'm at it :D


    Rarity as defined by Scholten in Coins of the Dutch Overseas Territories

    Scholten Description
    C Common
    N Normal
    S Scarce
    R Rare
    RR Very Rare
    RRR Extremely Rare
    RRRR Of the utmost rarity


    Michael Marsh in his book The Gold Sovereign

    Marsh Description
    R4 15 to 25 examples known
    R5 9 to 14 examples known
    R6 4 to 8 examples known
    R7 Highest rarity known


    Andrew Pollock in his book US Patterns

    R1 over 1250 examples known
    R2 500 to 1250 examples known
    R3 201 to 500 examples known
    R4 76 to 200 examples known
    R5 31 to 75 examples known
    R6 13 to 30 examples known
    R7 4 to 12 Highest rarity known
    R8 2 or 3 examples known


    As I say - there are many, many rarity scales. It would almost take a book of its own to list them all.
     
  8. sylvester

    sylvester New Member

    Ah it was R7! Diff numbers too.

    All i know that if it's R4 it's rare enough for me! (no matter what scale you're on!) ;)
     
  9. satootoko

    satootoko Retired

    Now there's a project for you Doug. Maybe Krause would publish it. :p :D
     
  10. sugarfreak404

    sugarfreak404 New Member

    i don't know the mintage numbers for the 1882-CC so.....where does it fall in there?
     
  11. jody526

    jody526 New Member

    The 1882-CC Morgan dollar had a mintage of 1,133,000.

    Now how many are known to have survived, over the years, is quite another story.
     
  12. nesvt

    nesvt Coin Hoarder

    Bower's Red Book on Morgan's says 1,133,000.
     
  13. sugarfreak404

    sugarfreak404 New Member

    just wondering...
    are there any #'s for how many Unc. 1882-CC there are?
     
  14. nesvt

    nesvt Coin Hoarder

    I type too slow.

    Don't forget the rarity scale for Morgan varieties in the VAM book. R-1 through R-8.

    1 tens of millions
    2 several millions
    3 hundreds of thousands
    4 tens of thousands
    5 several thousands
    6 several hundred
    7 few - 10
    8 several
     
  15. nesvt

    nesvt Coin Hoarder

    I can give you field population numbers from the Bower's book.

    400,000 - 500,000 MS60 - MS62
    160,000 - 210,000 MS63
    80,000 - 110,000 MS64
    20,000 - 35,000 MS65
    1,500 - 2,500 MS66
    150 - 250 MS67
    1 - 2 MS68 - MS70
     
  16. sugarfreak404

    sugarfreak404 New Member

    now all i have to do is get my camera to work so yall can help me figure out which one of THOSE it falls in!

    i can't grade
     
  17. jody526

    jody526 New Member

    I'll bet you could, if you set your mind to it. ;)
     
  18. National dealer

    National dealer New Member

    Now you have to take into consideration that the population numbers are only for those certified by a grading company or in a GSA holder. It does not take into account the many thousands of raw examples.
    The 82,83 amd 84 CC Morgans are certainly the easiest to acquire.
     
  19. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator


    Gee thanks Roy :rolleyes: That's all I need - one more thing I have to write :p
     
  20. sugarfreak404

    sugarfreak404 New Member

    let me rephrase that

    i can't grade even close to acurattly (and i can't spell either)
     
  21. sugarfreak404

    sugarfreak404 New Member

    now what about the 1882-O? (not sure what condition) are they so easily aquired?? (i'm trying to find out if i have any coins that are really worth anything)
     
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