Here Is A Very Nice 1933 USA Gold Coin, REAL!

David Hall once told me that a dealer friend had seen a '64 peace dollar. Hard to know if they really exist. Cal

 

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At least they would still exist, and we would have some idea of how they looked. Now they are probably all gone. The Smithsonian is the national coin collection. It’s where the U.S. Mint collection went.

I don’t like the idea that the Smithsonian has received coins no one ever sees. I would rather those coins were in private hands. I am thinking about the Lilly Collection. Pictures of these coins should be available to collectors and researchers at no charge.

 

I agree with that to an extent. I don't see it unreasonable to have them on an exhibit every once and a while. I don't know what the Lilly Collection is, but I'm about to look into it since I'm already hopping between here/the Smithsonian archives.

 

The Lilly Collection was from the drug company family. They donated the collection of gold coins, which included one of the three 1822 half eagles, in exchange for a tax credit. Some of the coins were on display in one of those rotating tray display cases for a while. Now they are in vaults.

One thing that drives me nuts about museums is that they will show coins to 12 year old interns, but an old guy like me, who has been a numismatic student for over 50 years, can’t see them.

 

Is the Lilly Collection from the Estate of Josiah K. Lilly Jr.? That's mostly what I've been coming across and it seems to be exclusively gold world coins.

 

Beat me to it and fits that exact description because they also have an old desk for "organic drugs". I see no logic and/or reason in that sort of exclusivity either (unless the opportunity to become an intern for *them* is the same for all.) It's like yeah, you might have years of being a numismatic student but sometimes you just have to play "their" game for a little bit for some self-enjoyment.
https://www.si.edu/object/lillys-students-collection-official-organic-drugs:nmah_687864

 

You can see at least some of them in images on their collection website. I'm sure a lot of them have never been photographed though. When researching the disappeared Yale example of the 1652 NE threepence, the curator there said many in their collection (especially the ones stolen during the 1960s) had never been photographed. It was too expensive back in the day.

Here are the Smithsonian's 1933 $20. Is either one on display?
https://americanhistory.si.edu/collections/object/nmah_1090309
https://americanhistory.si.edu/collections/object/nmah_1288638

 

Looks like the 2nd one is and it's in DC under the "value of money" exhibit

 

It’s not too expensive now. They don’t have any excuses because digital photography has been around for a long time. One would think that they would want pictures of everything significant for security purposes. I was able to download a few pictures, like the photos of the unique 1849 $20 gold piece for an exhibit. Other pictures were blocked or unavailable.

 

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So are you accusing me of being an "infamous counterfeiter" ?
If so, that is a serious accusation.

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The "1958-D" Lincoln in question has two differences from the known issued coins of that date and mint: a doubled die obverse; and a reverse "V.D.B." mark (similar to the first 1909 issue).

But this is an unusual circumstance in that all of the pieces that I issued are struck over genuine US Mint 1958-D Lincoln cents. An analogy would be someone who took a genuine 1958-D Lincoln Cent and via "hobo" carving (or similar), added some obverse doubling, added a reverse "VDB" mark, and then sold it as a novelty item with full disclosure.

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I’m disappointed in the Smithsonian website. It’s rather cursory and has been for years. The ANS website is much better for coins. That said, I enjoy visiting the museums. Coins are displayed in areas other the National Coin Collection gallery. I remember a few years ago seeing an extensive group of U.S. gold coins in a gallery dedicated to American history. And I have been a subscriber to their magazines for years.

Cal

 

Dan.... I won't even bother engaging you again because we have argued so many times on so many forums over so many years. I have stated my opinion so many times. There are many reputable people who agree with my opinions, and you remain popular in the conversation. Nobody has done anything about you yet.... Why even bother. We both know what we think of each other.

You think I'm libelling you, I think you're....

 

You can almost always tell that it is an overstrike. The luster is not mint luster. The dies aren't and couldn't be matched. The whole style of production is different. I wouldn't disagree that in the wrong hands these tokens could fool someone that knows nothing or very little. The problem is that most good dealers know what they are looking at, second most B&M that I visit won't even look at them them, they send them out the door because they don't know what they are looking at, they won't even give an offer. The third type of dealer is the one that knows what they have label it, and put it on the floor with a market price. These tokens don't get passed on as fakes. And as said already it would be the ignorant dealer that gets charged when it does happen. Every DCarr has an insert, and is show with mintages on his website.

 

As far as what I didn't say in response to @physics-fan3.14 , if he is still listening. I have always listened to you and appreciate your knowledge. I think that you are wrong about DC. He is a stand up guy that I have met many times, he was good to my kid, and a very knowledgeable numismatist just as yourself.
As far as the gold above, and the mintage of DCarrs pieces. When they are found they will be attributed as a Fantasy coin, and priced well above melt, but never near the value of a true rarity.

I have never iggy'ed anyone I am not gonna start now. I will say it again I appreciate your presence here. Wish you would post more.

 

We all have opinions. These things have created a lot of hate on both sides of the issue and friends have been lost. The hobby didn't need this. The China stuff was already bad enough. They now have an open door to do anything they want. I'm sure there are folks right here in the US gearing up to join the fun.

 

The first over-strike that I did was the "1964-D" Peace in 2010. It has been 15 years since then and during that time has anyone else "geared up" ?

Note that here were (crude) Chinese-made 1964-D Peace Dollars in the marketplace prior to 2010.

 

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I seriously doubt that this will be the last time you comment on a "Dan Carr" item.

Who are these "reputable people" you write of ?
Is PCGS reputable ?
They certify/grade/encapsulate my "1964-D" Peace, "1975" Eisenhower, and other items. See this link:
https://www.pcgs.com/coinfacts/coin/1964-d-1-x-383-peace-dollar-daniel-carr-fantasy/877747

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I grabbed the Susan B, there are some nice outlines.

Can't find much on the reverse.

That eagle has the gnarliest teeth.