Early copper guys, lmk what you think

After going back and forth with a seller today, we came to an agreement and I think I got a nice deal on this 1798 large cent which I'd grade VG for my US type set.
Just a slightly better one doubles in price so I was happy to use my eBay bucks on this one with at least a clear date and a nice reverse. I'm not big into coppers but I may work on finishing the page next year. Anything I should know about this one?

 

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I'll ID it for you and take you through the steps I use.


1. Second Letter style with more pronounced serifs on the L and Es. This eliminates obverses 1 - 6.

2. Style 1 hair without the extra curl behind the shoulder. This eliminates obverses 20 - 34.

3. Small 8. This eliminates obverses 7 - 10 and confirms elimination of 1 - 6.

4. Obverse 11 date is too widely spaced for a match.

5. Obverse 12 8 is too distant from bust.

6. Obverse 13 2nd Highest wave of hair is left of upright of E. Doesn't match.

7. Obverse 14 looks close, but IB looks a little further apart than on yours. But we'll leave it as a possibility.

8. Obverse 15 spacing of date and LIBERTY are both too wide for a match.

9. Obverse 16 - 7 between dentils. Not a match.

10 Obverse 17 - Date widely spaced. Not a match.

11. Obverse 18 - Looks like a match. Hair on both look unfinished.

12. Obverse 19 - Also looks like a match. Need to look at the differences.

13 Obverse 20 - 1 too close to hair. Not a match.

So back to 18 and 19. Flattened knob at 9 on obverse 19. Nope Also the under loop is thinner as is Obverse 18. So this should be S-162. the only reverse pairing is Reverse O.

That looks right.

S-162 is an R4- in Breen, but has been called R4 at times.

Nice find.

 

Very good! That matches up with what it was listed as.

 

It is a nice example of a fairly scarce die variety. I think the price paid was fair.

 

I am definitely impressed!

 

Thanks. I think so too considering fees and the fact he still has to get it here.

I love the look of it. Even with the pitting.

 

There's always that element of hope that the coin matches up with the images until you see it in the copper. I know I'm still waiting for my S-45 to come off layaway and arrive so we're kind of in that same boat.

 

Apparently my reading comprehension skills are somewhat lacking. Where does the price paid appear in this thread??

 

Since the OP mentioned this was an Ebay purchase, you can look it up in Ebay completed sales - 1798 cents.

 

I'll save everybody the trouble. It was $220 shipped. Seller was fairly generous from original price. I used eBay bucks towards it too.

 

I like it at that price very much!

 

Yeah he thought about it for quite a while. I don't think he wanted to go that low. It does have corrosion. But still nice eye appeal.

 

Lucky it is a rare variety at that price so you did well!

 

At one time I would have agreed. But lately. just about any coin with a little detail and not severely damaged seems to be bringing prices that only a couple of years ago were reserved for those rare relatively problem free coppers in the lower grades. Even detail coins with moderate to severe condition issues seem to have a floor near where only coins in premium condition could command until recently.

This would make being a scarce variety an even better bargain

 

Marshall, What reference book would you recommend to help with the analysis you did? I have Penny Whimsy, BTW. Thank you.

 

I have Penny Whimsy as well, Breen's Encyclopedia and I use the images from the Holmes sale supplemented with ANS and Heritage Auction sites for images which I can enlarge without losing detail.

I find the Heritage Archives quite helpful with Die varieties and die states. But you can easily tell when an EACer takes part in writing the description and when they don't.

 

http://images.goldbergauctions.com/php/auctions.php

Holmes catalogs (as mentioned by Marshall) can be found here.

 

I actually use the icollector site for my Holmes images. They are a uniform 400x400 pixels and I like the presentation.

http://www.icollector.com/The-Pre-Long-Beach-Sale_as14916

 

For now, I think using this open forum is the best way to get the most interest and involvement. I will begin with proposing a new Die State format using Sheldon's Obverse and Reverse designations for the dies themselves followed by a period and then a numeral based Die State. This would look some thing like this:

1796 7.1 to identify the die as the 7th obverse Die at Die State 1. But we might also go with 1796 7.01 since a few dies have more than 9 die states and some software would have problems sorting anything higher than 9 properly.

Since this die is used on both the NC-1 and S-92, Breen's Die State information would have to be incorporated rather than used as a basis for a system. Getting away from the Roman Numerals for Die State would help avoid confusion between the systems.