Buying Ancients, some questions

Oooh. Is this a contest! I dont charge anyone any fees, cash, check, credit card or any of the plethora of other venues (no Bitcoin!!!!). Plus, I ship for free worldwide! Many people add fees for using anything other than cash. I dont. No postage, either

 

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There's a lot of difference in methods of paying between Europe and the USA, that's rather frustrating. In Europe, cashing a check is expensive, and in the USA wiring money is next to impossible. People charge extra for wiring, or they do for credit cards or checks. With all the slick banks in the world, they haven't managed to make paying easy between continents.

 

You were mainly who I was thinking about, you & Nathan (Anoob)

 

Well, that's good to know. It's a shame they don't make it clear, but I'll call in and do so now. I'm tired of having to wire them money.

 

You've been wiring the money to CNG?! OMG!! I hope it doesn't cost you as much as it costs me to wire money.

Lack of website-enabled payment aside, CNG is my favorite auction house for many reasons. Lack of extra fee for payments by credit card is one of those reasons. At first I'd call them and tell the to run the invoice through the card, now I just email them after receiving the invoice ("pay for invoice #xxxx with my usual card"). You could probably also just give them standing instructions to automatically use whatever card you keep on file with them.

 

I do this with CNG but would not suggest it with a seller you don't feel certain about in every way. If you forget you bid on something, it can turn up as a surprise in your mailbox which is OK with me.

I believe the trick is to buy the right coin from the right source. CNG has little demand for cheap coins and a fee structure that makes consignors unlikely to list $50 coins. They have relatively cheap electronic sales, middle level printed auctions and the high end Triton sales (which rarely have a coin I have a hope of winning). eBay is a good place to buy junkers but expensive coins there tend to be priced by dreamers hoping you won't notice defects (being fake is a big defect!).

Don't buy raw fish at McDonalds; if they forget to cook it that does not make it Sushi.

 

LOL, I set it up with Karen to just auto-charge my CC. I get the invoice AFTER I see it hitting my card. Easy, and they are great with me.

 

LOL, That is going into my quote book!

 

Karen and everyone else at CNG are so fantastic! All of my phone and email interactions with them have been a pleasure. Except for Ardy... what a tool.

(KIDDING, of course . Ardy/Bill is awesome too.)

 

No problems with CNG. They charge my credit card after the auction and ship my coin(s).

 

Well I must say, I am certainly glad I asked and gave examples. Thanks to all for all the responses. As always I learn so much.

I also went from not having anyplace to buy from to now I need to figure out what to buy first. My initial list grew very rapidly. I now have so many stores and places to buy from I am quite overwhelmed. Which is a good thing. I have been looking all afternoon as the links come in going, Oh I want one of those, I want one of those, I want one of those. Then looking up references as well going well I wanted one of these, how much do they cost.

 

If you buy from Vcoins, there is no harm in asking them what their best price is. They may knock a bit off for you.

 

Actually it might irritate a dealer. I have some people constantly asking for discounts. I even had a customer that started to think that every purchase should be discounted...I blocked him.

 

I have only done it a couple of times, once when I bought two coins (the discount they gave covered the postage to the UK) and once when I thought that the price was excessive. I appreciate dealers need to make a profit and their stock may sit on the shelves a long time, but some prices are ridiculous.

 

It takes all kinds. I know one dealer who greets people at shows with "If you see anything you like, I can do better." I know dealers who never budge on a price. I do not ask for a discount on a coin that I will buy at list price and I don't ask about coins that are several times what I will pay unless they are owned by a dealer that I know is into halving all prices. I don't know if Victor has blocked me or not but I do know that I don't buy from dealers who do not reply to inquiries whether that inquiry be about price or something technical about the coin. Lets just say all dealers have enough patrons that they don't need my business so I will deal with the ones who have time to answer their mail and ship coins when ordered. One thing I really like about eBay/Paypal is the way the sellers are required to keep you posted or that the software automatically keeps you posted when the item ships and when it should be expected. Enough VCoins dealers seem particularly bad about this to the point I wonder if their software even notifies them when someone places an order.

 

If paid through PayPal, their emails surly go through. I made a purchase on Vcoins one time the seller never responded, even when I had to file a refund case due to non-communication. The seller must have received those emails as they go directly to their email. The whole experience made me think of an unmanned ghost ship traveling through the Bermuda Triangle, the shop is up but nobody is home.

 

I have never even thought about it Doug. The person I blocked was incessant with demands for discounts and free shipping. He also wanted me to hold coins for months at a time, which sometimes added up to thousands of dollars and made the shipping even more expensive for me. This guy was a real headache for me...you have a long way to go yet

 

You're probably one of those dealers who is both knowledgeable and thoughtful about the coins he sells, and sets his prices reasonably -- relative to his expectations for those collectors who might be looking for ancient coins. If so, you may be in the minority, even among the generally ethical dealers on VCoins.

Here's an example of why I would always try to negotiate a price for a coin that's in a dealer's catalogue: About a year ago I saw a gold aureus of Tiberius sell at auction for about $18K, including buyer's fees. A week later the VCoins dealer who purchased it had it listed for $39K on his site. Markups like these are good reasons to negotiate prices.

I do understand how constant, incessant haggling can be tiresome and irritating. But surely dealers' catalog prices are set at the higher end of the price range for which they'd sell, allowing a little leeway for a serious buyer whose budget may not stretch enough to pay the asking price.

Not ever having been a coin dealer, I'd love to hear more from you about your stance on negotiating or haggling over prices.

EDIT: OK, you answered my question above while I was composing and typing this post...

 

We have another 'situation'. Some dealers are really dealers buying and selling coins to put food on the table. Some are in it for the hobby. They buy a vCoins membership, work coin shows and issue lists but their main interest is building their collection. A dealer who does not want to sell a coin can put a price on it that will guarantee that it will only sell for a price that he could survive the loss of a friend. The $18k coin marked to $39k can be enjoyed for a while and eventually sold for half price. Is a 100% markup all that unusual? Whenever any of us sell something we might wonder if we could have got more. Marking a coin at a very high price makes room for 'professional' discounts without ruling out the possibility that a billionaire beginner will pay full price.

Should dealers get a discount when they buy from each other or should they pay full buyer's fees and full retail when they are buying stock or personal items? How many dealers are really hobbyists playing businessman?

 

I agree with this and have been in the same boat. I missed out on a coin at auction. The coin went for about 750.00. The week after I saw the same coin on a VCoins dealer's site for over 2000.00. Given, sometimes one gets steals at auctions but a 1250.00 difference? Right then I decided I would never buy from this dealer. A markup I can understand but that much? A dealer can ask whatever they want for a coin but I do not have to pay it. In short, I have asked for a discount on coins before, especially if I have seen the same coin on the site for months. I definitely do not want to anger dealers, that is not in my best interest. By the way, I believe that coin I mentioned still has not sold.