NGC vs. PCGS the difference and why the premiums shift.

Thank you GDJMSP......that clarifies a few things for me. I never really thought about it that way. That's a good point for me to remember. Thanks again! Knowledge IS power.

swick

 

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Since most of my coins will probably be sold someday by someone other than me, having a TPG slab will prevent some dishonest dealer from trying to make the case that the coin is harshly cleaned, damaged, worn, or counterfeit. So the authentication and grading by a top TPG is valuable in my opinion.

 

I think the trick is to try and avoid being stuck with coins like these:

1 1 13818316 9170 1920 $20 US Not Genuine
2 1 13818317 8882 1926 $10 US Not Genuine
3 1 13818318 8878 1915 $10 US Not Genuine
3 2 13818319 8878 1915 $10 US Not Genuine
3 3 13818320 8878 1915 $10 US Not Genuine
4 1 13818321 8875 1914 $10 US Not Genuine
5 1 13818322 8871 1912 $10 US Not Genuine
6 1 13818323 8868 1911 $10 US Not Genuine
6 2 13818324 8868 1911 $10 US Not Genuine

Or these:

1 1 13891290 8868 1911 $10 US Questionable Color
2 1 13891291 8174 1836 $5 US Altered Surface
3 1 13891292 8514 1909-D $5 US Cleaned
4 1 13891293 7850 1898 $2.50 US Altered Surface
5 1 13891294 7747 1847-O $2.50 US Questionable Color
6 1 13891295 7466 1926 $2.50 Sesquicentennial US Cleaned
7 1 13891296 7575 1874 G$1 US Scratch or Rim Nick
8 1 13891297 7950 1926 $2.50 US Scratch or Rim Nick
9 1 13891298 8082 1800 $5 US Damage or Tooling
10 1 13891299 8000 1878 $3 US Damage or Tooling
11 1 13891300 7443 1903 G$1 LA Purch-Jefferson US Cleaned
12 1 13891301 8871 1912 $10 US Altered Surface
13 1 13891302 8527 1914 $5 US Cleaned
14 1 13891303 7560 1862 G$1 US Scratch or Rim Nick

 

I would like to ammend the above sentence to read:

You will also find many that have been cleaned, recolored, artificially toned, tooled, corroded, scratched, puttied, lasered, with rim dings, and lots of other problems that have either gone undetected or deemed "market acceptable".

:secret:

Buy the coin, not the TPG's grade or opinion on market acceptability...Mike

 

i have another example of a difference in price

for the 1862 3cs ms64 ot goes for 375 in ngc but and average of 550 in pcgs

also i think if you regrade the coin then it should say in the holder like resubmited X number of times so then you could tell it was a slider

 

CentDime:
I am very sorry to see that listing.
I hope that they are not all yours, but presume that they are.
Better luck next time.

 

Those can from the shared order page at PCGS so thankfully they are not mine. I haven't had a coin bodybagged yet, knock on wood.:hammer:

 

PCGS vs NGC

Hello All,

I am a newbie here but love the debate over these two grading services. I use them both and no others. My opinion is that PCGS has "Snob Appeal" over NGC. Sort of Like Mercedes Benz over Volkswagen. Why? I think there are a number of reasons. One: If you read the grading criteria of the different grading services PCGS, includes the very subjective "superior eye appeal" as a factor. Most services only require the coin be completely original "as struck". Two: By controlling the number of higher grade coins the PCGS cartel is only ensuring the rarity of many issues.Three: NGC grades more (some times 10x) than PCGS. Hence ther are less PCGS. The discriminating investor will pay the PCGS premium because "there is never a recession at the Merceds dealer", there is an abundance of affluent, albeit pretentious, buyers in todays market place and they are buying PCGS, because they can.
Anyway that is my opinion, thanks for hearing me out
.

 

This has been an enlightening thread, thanks to all for the input and especially to GDJMSP and Cloudsweeper, and of course the original poster. This question has been bugging me for years. Given that PCGS and NGC are the top graders. Given that I cannot grade a MS65 or a MS66 but I know the basics to look for. Does anybody know what the grading criteria of PCGS and NGC are on an given coin? What are the standards these two grading companies are using? There must be written down specs. e.g. bag marks per square centimeter, etc.

The consensus seems to be that these two grading companies are about equal in incompetance. If that statement is true then NGC coins will rise and PCGS will fall untill thermal equlibrium is met

 

i looked at about 100 slabbed Mercury dimes over the past few days at the Baltimore show - i bought 5 slabbed coins, all graded as MS 65 and a buddy bought a few graded MS 66. we eachhad coins from NGC and PCGS and could not find a difference between the 2 grades or slabbers - seriously - he paid $20.00 more for a coin that looked no better, no worse than my coin of the smae year.

we tried very hard to find something that put his up a notch - the only thing we found was a very tiny scratch on the cheek vs. his having a scratch on the neck. both required a high power loupe - we couldn't see them with my 10x.

and then there is the issue of consistent grading - neither PCGS or NGC seems to be able to grade a coin series in a consistent manner. i walked away from many MS65's that had many visible blemishes and nicks in the prime focal areas and scratched my head at coins graded MS63 that looked far better than an MS65 right next to it.

buy the coin, not the slab. the best is when a dealer writes over a grade with a Sharpie - that MS 63 coin is clearly an MS65 because he said so ;0

-steve

 

That's exactly the point of having eleven different grades for coins that show absolutely no wear.
You were never intended to be able to tell the difference.
The only people who can do that, are those with special talent, and they aren't in business to go broke.

 

I can't tell the difference between a 65 and 66 either. In fact, I have a couple of modern 65s where I can't tell the difference from a 67 or even a 69 from the same year and series. I guess I just pay a lot more attention to getting a coin I want that looks good to me at a good-to-great price. I'm not really into the game of who own's the highest grade, and Speedy sort of convinced me that in all probability there is no such thing as a 70 so it makes no sense at all to pay up for one of those slabs.

 

I would then suggest that it is the resale potential to unsophisticated buyers like myself who buy at auctions and believe in the petigree of the slab. I don't buy anything from Bob Chambers and Company but listen to him. He says that the PCGS and NGC slabs can be sold without looking at them, even across the big ponds.