I've submitted only about a dozen coins for grading over the years. Nothing major, just average submissions in my opinion. I recently submitted an 1889 three cent nickel. Just a normal submission, nothing special. I was thinking the coin would grade at least fine condition. It came back VF 20 cleaned/details. However, I looked at the coin in the slab. It had die cracks which I (for whatever reason) completely missed! The slab was not labeled, identifying the coin as having die cracks. Question: Shouldn't the TPG have graded the coin identifying the die cracks? I'm assuming (and I probably shouldn't be), they should have caught this. Correct?
Yes, but if I didn't know or didn't have any reason to believe it was a variety, wouldn't they have notified me?
No. NGC and PCGS attribute varieties, errors and strike designations. NGC also uses the star (*) designation for "eye appeal". Die cracks don't fall into any of these categories.
Die cracks don't make it a variety, unless it's a special exception where the die cracks form a specific variety, like the 1807 "bearded goddess" bust half or the 1839-O "cobwebs reverse" seated liberty dime. In those rare cases, the later die state of progressing die cracks made it a sort of unique variety. Three cent pieces are very often found with die cracks and clashing. It is very common, and there are no varieties the stem from those cracks. PCGS will not put, " die cracks" on the label. But they will put "clashed dies" if you submit it under the mint error tier. And none of the TPG'S will i.d. a variety for you unless you ask for it and or pay for it. Unless they just happen to catch it by accident, which isn't often.
Die cracks do not usually point to a certain variety. Not sure if it's different with 3c CNs but I doubt it as NGC lists mainly DDO/DDRs. If you pay for the variety attribution, the label will include the variety - if they recognize it. E.g. NGC recognizes the following varieties: https://www.ngccoin.com/coin-varieties/two-and-three-cents/three-cent-nickels-vscid-35/
No, PCGS and NGC grade millions of coins a year. They will attribute some major varieties automatically, everything else if you don't pay for they won't waste their time attributing every coin and asking people if they want to change their mind. ANACS is the same way which is where it sounds like you sent this one. Same goes for errors, if you want the error designations it needs to be submitted as an error.
@World Colonial @C-B-D @micbraun @baseball21 Okay, so I see two problems. First, the TPG is ANACS. Second, I should have spotted the die cracks before submitting it, paid for it and ID'ed the variety/error attribution on the submission form. So basically, it was operator error on my part!
Final question: If you had (let's say) a rare beautiful toned coin with a small die crack, chip or cud on it, would you want that die crack, chip or cud listed on the slab? I guess it would depend on what you're looking for but in general, would something like that detract or add to a coins grading. Or wouldn't it make any difference?
I really don't think it would make a difference unless it was a famous one such as the "spiked chin" 1/2 cent or any other in greater demand than a plain coin of that date .
Some series are collected by variety, so using the die crack to attribute the specific dies used and putting that on the label would be valuable, large cents and bust halfs are collected like this. But for coins which are not generally collected by variety, I would not want it on the label, and it would lower my desire/price for the coin. For a type set collection, early die state coins have more eye appeal than later die state coins and often bring a premium.
I see where your thinking is. Die cracks will not affect grading, as they are a result of the transfer of the design and all the flaws on that die to the blank planchet. Therefor it is as struck and shall remain that way. Clashed dies are technically a mint error as the mint does not intend for the dies to make contact with each other only the intended planchet. Because clashed dies leave marks on each other, they in turn leave those marks on subsequent coins which can be very numerous, which in turn causes there to not be much interest in them or cause a significant premium. It is not the responsibility of TPG's to catch varieties for you, they are there simply to grade coins. If you submit a coin for variety attribution, it then is their responsibility to attribute the coin, because you are paying them to. There are a lot of Cherrypickers' out there including myself, who check slabbed coins for unattributed varieties. They happen a lot. Die cracks don't make a variety but they can help you to attribute some. There are a couple of varieties that are due to die cracks, the 1888-O "Scarface" Morgan and the 1952 "Scarface" Franklin Half Dollar. Those are more of a die break than than a die crack however.
Forgot to mention, whatever TPG you pick make sure they recognize the variety before submitting it. It's a bit expensive to find out the hard way they don't do a particular one.
True , I collect Bust halves by Overton # and a die crack can help ID that Overton , but I wouldn't want a die crack listed just the Overton # and I imagine the Large cents would want their # also .
You would never want die cracks attributed on the label. Even those instances where the die cracks in a late die state create their own variety, it's still the variety being attributed, not the die cracks.
