New blog: numismaticfakes

No story from me please on your website.

I probably shouldn't continue to rail on them. I did enough of it over at Forvm and got admonished by the owner of the site because apparently I was only supposed to talk badly about fraudulent eBay sellers and not actual 'dealers'. One of the reasons I don't participate over there to any extent anymore.

If you want material for ACR, check out Auction 12 from 2014 which is downright scandalous. There was a bunch of posts on it on Lamoneta.it and Forvm. Dozens of major, obvious fakes.

This is the coin from my experience with the firm. A pressed fake made with modern transfer dies (I mean, a famous old collection coin).

 

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There seems to be a lot of that. Many of us have experienced similar reactions at FAC.

 

I am quite disappointed by the handful of dealers these days (ACR is one of the worst offenders) who seem to just screen coins using the market to determine what is/is not genuine rather than thoroughly checking them in-house first. It's put them and a couple others firmly on my list of "must have multiple in-hand opinions".

 

I sent an email to Roma Numismatics informing them that lots 20 and 50 in their upcoming e-sale have been listed as fakes on Odysseus' blog. I received the following reply from the director:
"I am out of the office at present, but will investigate and take appropriate action as necessary on Friday."

The latest entry at the OP blog is another eyebrow-raiser from a 2004 article in Harvard magazine, which condemned two didrachms of Karystos from the famed Dewing collection as fakes!

 

Looking through the blog, I recommend including solid and detailed information as to why a given coin has been condemned, or links to that information-- for every coin shown. Perhaps such information is there but I somehow missed it?

Even on Forvm I'm sometimes skeptical of some coins which are condemned as fakes, and mistakenly condemning an authentic coin does as much damage as having fakes in the marketplace. I'm not saying any of the entries on the OP's blog are in necessarily in error but without irrefutable proof, I cannot take it as gospel, only as food for thought.

 

Hi all,
I always link the sources, if there are some. In the case of the coin from Kroton, it was condemned on lamoneta, but in this case really there's no need to post any link. Just enough to look at style, reliefs and details. For example, does anyone have ever seen a thoroat like that on a krotonian coin? Hera Lakinia seems to have a thyroid goiter! That odd die is not listed on any published collection or study. The engravers of ancient Kroton would never have produced something like that. Before condemning it I've also check Attianese's work, which is the most accurate on that mint and the varieties issued. If anyone will ever make me see a match for that die from a specimen listed in reliable collections or studies, I will delete my article on blog.
Thanks all for your interest on my site.
With kindest regards.
Odysseus

 

These coins are way over my budget, but I have read the blog with great interest and have bookmarked it. Thanks for all your hard work.

 

They've always seemed like nice guys to me who tried to be honest but were disturbingly clueless about ancient coins. The fact that they didn't bother to retrieve the fake they sold you makes me rethink that. It seems they indeed know exactly what they're doing. If this had been a legitimate consignment they would need to return it to the collector; as it is, the only plausible scenario is that ACR received the fake with their eyes wide open, directly from the forger or a middleman.

 

Precisely.

 

Grazie mille.

 

We always advise people to buy from dealers they trust but trust is a two part matter. I trust you to be honest and I trust you to be knowledgeable (at least more than I am). If I can not trust you in both of those two respects, I can't justify paying you big money including buyer's fees to account for your staff of experts. If I am going to be buying on the 'Buyer Beware' system, I may as well buy from eBay. Fortunately I do not have so much money to spend on coins that I can not avoid 90% of the people selling them for one reason or another. Those of you with the burning urge to buy big and buy now will have to play a different game.

 

Some do, others give only limited guarantee.

 

Thanks to Ancientnut for bringing to my attention lot 50 in our current sale. This has been examined, and withdrawn as a modern fake. Lot 20 on the other hand, which came in for an 'interesting' treatment on Odysseus' blog site, in fact does seem to be ancient, albeit an ancient plated counterfeit. Its lot description has therefore been amended to reflect this fact. The odd appearance seems to be a combination of dies not quite in the right style, and heavy wear that has 'smudged' the metal.

While I certainly agree that educating novice or less well informed collectors about forgeries is highly important, I feel I must point out two things. Firstly, although some coins are very very clearly fake, and deserve to be pointed out for the benefit of the aforementioned, many cannot be identified as such purely on the basis of a photograph - they may need to examined carefully under high powered magnification or physically authenticated by other means. This is why even very experienced numismatists will usually refrain from opining on a coin's authenticity without having first seen it in hand.

Moreover, I cannot really emphasise enough how important it is to notify the dealer/seller/auctioneer of a coin which is known or suspected of being fake so that it can be examined, and if necessary withdrawn. Many auction houses, ours included, handle an enormous volume of coins every month which inevitably means that occasionally a mistake can be made. As has been well pointed many times before by many other people, we are all human - but the difference between a reputable seller and the other kind is what happens when those mistakes are pointed out.

 

Gentle Mr. Rich Beale,
thank you very much for your post.
I just edited the article on my blog, adding your observations and my comments about the questioned coin. I also modified tags of the article.
With kindest regards.
Odysseus

 

I see also lot 50, discussed in my blog here and here, has been withdrawn today.
Thank you Mr. Beale!
Odysseus

 

You have shown yourselves to be a stand-up firm in dealing with this, but sometimes a photograph is all a prospective buyer has to deal with. I have been saved by members of CoinTalk twice when dealing with obvious fakes. If it is obvious, it should be told.

 

This coin, posted on Odysseus' fakes blog, sold in Gerhard Hirsch 319 this morning for EUR 8,000!
https://numismaticfakes.wordpress.c...-griechische-munzen-italien-kalabrien-tarent/

 

New fakes currently on auction...
https://numismaticfakes.wordpress.com/2016/05/06/currently-on-auction-man-faked-bull-and-others/

 

And let's add this gem from the Lanz auction.

https://www.sixbid.com/browse.html?auction=2753&category=57561&lot=2328001

Tourist fake/fantasy piece for sale in the latest Lanz auction:



A real example from the Berlin Museum:

 

Are there any 'variations' that exhibit a similar rendition like the 'tourist fake/fantasy example? Specifically, I mean the distinctively decorated amphora and thunder bolts??

Sheesh, I wouldn't be able to tell it was a fake unless it was already identified as such...except the lettering looks 'off' to me for the type.