Anyone good at late Roman bronze monograms?

Does this look right for Anthemius?


It's in a forthcoming auction. But i just cannot find an Anthemius monogram quite like that one. The closest i can find is:



I like monogram AE4s, however I'm not finding a 100% matching monogram - but I lack a proper reference book, so all I've got is what's online.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

Out of my sphere but in case you haven't already looked here...

http://www.catbikes.ch/coinstuff/monograms.htm

An extremely hasty scan of those monograms didn't reveal a match for you coin but I could have easily overlooked something.

 

Thanks TIF I'll add that site to my bookmarks, didn't know about that one!

No match for Anthemius there. But I don't see any other monograms that work either.

There isn't enough obverse legend to give me the ruler - I can see "DN" and maybe an "A" - or is that half of an "M" (Marcian?) ... it's like looking for shapes in clouds.

I guess it's another "If there's doubt, there's no doubt".

And I need an Anthemius too.

 

Greg: I have been collecting monograms for many years and I have seen this exact coin a couple of times before. It is certainly a fake.

 

By the way, the inexpensive little paperback "Piccoli Bronzi con Monogramma" by Antonio Morello is probably the best reference book for late Roman, Byzantine and Ostrogothic monograms. It's in Italian but it's still very, very easy to go through.

 

is well done.
why you think that?

 

Milco: These have been showing up on ebay lately and always from a seller in Serbia. Here's another one I just found (copy and paste the link):

http://tinyurl.com/anthemius

They are all from the same dies and very fake.

 

The coin it is little different ,small head , different mongram,.but well done.
Can be an easter mint !?

 

Damastion?! Why to do these differrent each other?

 

Thanks guys. Yes, it did not like right so I did not bid on it. I didn't actually think the obverse was too bad. Just that weird monogram on the reverse - not right for Anthemius.

I'm not very trusting of post-Libius Severus monograms and AE4s. I was sold a "Julius Nepos" monogram about a year ago. According to an expert that you probably know, it is likely a tooled Libius Severus. This is an area of coin collecting where tooling/fakery is rampant.

 

I love these later 5th cent. Romans but wish I had the budget for the rarer rulers and types. Only was able to afford my Placidia and Jovinus through lots of selling and trading. That being said it sucks to know that more attention from forgers is being directed towards this general area. The gold coins I understand (faking them is still wrong though), but little nummi like these?

 

Hey Greg, wise decision. As you stated earlier "If there's doubt, there's no doubt". It's kind of odd with Anthemius, there are seven known monogram types of his but most of these are only known through very few examples. The odds of finding an authentic one on ebay is nearly zero. Same with Julius Nepos, by far the scarcest type. Incredibly I found a beautiful Nepos monogram in a dish of uncleaned widow's mites at a coin show for a whole one dollar. I think I used up all my luck for ten years on that find.

 

That's very impressive. My best bet of finding an affordable, attributable Nepos is a tremissis - maybe holed or a little bent, but that's good enough for me, and the auction price usually isn't too bad in these cases.

However I will probably never own Olybrius, Petronius Maximus or Romulus Augustus.

 

Greg, don't feel bad, 99.99% (maybe higher) of Roman collectors will never own one of these. I've been collecting for over 20 years and have never even seen a single one in person. We'll just leave these for the ultra-rich, and I'm sure not one of those.

 

If there's a dollar to be made somebody will be faking the coin. i doubt if anyone would fake a Leo monogram, but an Anthemius is a different story. You would think they could at least pick a monogram style that's accurate to the ruler.

 

Same here. It would take a big miracle for me to get a Romulus Augustus or a Glycerius or similar. Still holding out hope that I find an Odoacer coin I can afford. That is one ruler I very much desire for my collection.

 

Yes there will always be a hole in my collection for Glycerius too, forgot about him.

 

Figured since there are more popular things to forge (Eid Mar, Caligula denarii, etc.), late Roman nummi would for the most part be ignored by forgers, but I've been wrong before. Safe to say the Libius Severus that guy in your eBay link has is fake as well?

 

The horrible Libio S .is not Lib .S any way. The monogram don't match