Anyone else see a mask?

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by medoraman, Feb 26, 2016.

  1. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    So after the hammering at CNG, I had some hot money in my pocket. A friend showed me this one. As I love Elagabalus relating to the Emessa Stone and his role as chief priest, it was especially interesting to me.

    Anyone else notice what looks like a mask on his face on the reverse? You can only notice this on a few of these coins, and only in very high grade:

    elagabalus horn.jpg
    Elagabalus Denarius, struck AD 218-222 at Rome mint.
    Obv: IMP ANTONINVS PIVS AVG, horned, laureate, draped bust right, seen from front.
    Rev: SACERD DEI SOLIS ELAGAB, Elagabalus standing facing, head right, sacrificing from patera over lighted altar and holding small knotted staff upright, star in right field.
    3,11 g, 19 mm.
    RIC 131

    So I disagree with the description of this coin. One, I would think it should describe how he is wearing a mask, (though to be fair most examples of this type do not show a mask), and I do not believe its a star. I think its an embodiment of the Emessa Stone falling to earth.

    So am I just seeing things I want to see?
     
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  3. Ancientnoob

    Ancientnoob Money Changer

    I see what you mean.

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  4. Jwt708

    Jwt708 Well-Known Member

    I can see that as a mask.
     
  5. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    Yes, just like this. What is interesting is the string behind his head. This is missing on most coins of this Type. It looks like a ribbon that would be tied holding the mask on his head. To me this reinforces the notion this coin in particular was intentionally depicting some kind of priestly mask he would wear during the ceremony. Maybe it explains the horns on his head on the obverse, the horns could have been part of the mask.
     
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  6. Ancientnoob

    Ancientnoob Money Changer

    I am convinced he is wearing a mask, there is like no doubt in my mind.
     
  7. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    I remain to be convinced. These strings occur regularly are are the ties for the laurel wreah that the emperor wears on these types.

    [​IMG]
     
  8. TIF

    TIF Always learning.

    Looking through various archives (ahem... with larger pictures :D) I too am unconvinced. On some coins he is wearing a laurel wreath which has ties. Few coins have good detail on the emperor's face on the reverse and while I can image a mask on your coin, it is like looking at a cloud and seeing what you want to see.

    I don't recall reading anything about a mask as part of the priestly garb worn by Elagabalus when he was performing his El-Gabal rituals. I will keep an eye out for such references though and let you know if I come across any mention of such a mask.
     
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  9. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    Far be it from me to argue with Martin, but I believe it to be a mask. Very interesting.
     
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  10. Theodosius

    Theodosius Fine Style Seeker

    I think you nailed it!
     
  11. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    Yours is a good example of about 70% for this type. Maybe some celators in Rome actually saw him in the ceremony so engraved the mask? Or could it be its much harder to depict the mask, so most didn't? It does appear the mask examples are on higher style coins. Lower style ones, in my limited research, are exclusively non-mask wearing.

    Going through CNG's archives, for this type there are a couple of others I would say looks more like mine that this one. It is REALLY hard to tell, though, since the coin really needs to be gVF or higher, and from a non-worn reverse die, to really tell.

    Btw, what about the "star". On many coins, like mine, the upper "tail" is intentionally longer. Wouldn't that be indicative of a comet, and not a star?
     

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  12. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    There are many different sacrificing types with stars. Do you only see the mask with RIC 131 or on other types?

    I have a few of the other types here. None have a sign of a mask. The stars vary greatly. All are laureate. Some are half decent grade wise.

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  13. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

  14. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    Doubt mine is of much use.

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    You see a mask. I see a poorly engraved face. I don't think we will agree.
     
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  16. stevex6

    stevex6 Random Mayhem

    [​IMG]

    => awesome coin, medoraman ...

    Hey, if you see a mask, then there is a mask on "your" coin (cheers, coin-bro)
     
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  17. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    I really respect your opinion sir, and we can agree to disagree at this moment. Maybe in the future I will convince myself otherwise.

    What do you think about the "star versus comet" idea? Many of these coins show what I would characterize as clearly a comet, and not a star. This would make sense for a head priest worshiping a meteorite, no?
     
  18. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    Elagabalus worshipped Sol who is always depicted radiate. I believe the thinking is that the star represents the sun. Elagabalus is depicted sacrificing to Sol. The comet was believed to be a piece of Sol fallen to earth. There is too much variety in the stars for it to be conclusive in my view.
     
  19. Nemo

    Nemo Well-Known Member

    Is this CNG coin a reverse die match to the OP coin? If so, it doesn't add weight to the idea of a mask. Not looking to parrot maridvnvm but I too only see a poorly engraved face.
     
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  20. Aidan_()

    Aidan_() Numismatic Contributor

    Wow, is sure does look like a match don't it? If it is a die match, I have to agree that it's not a mask, I'm not entirely leaning on poor engraving but a die chip of some sort on the face giving it that mask appearance.
     
  21. WDF

    WDF Its all about history

    I think it could be a mask...It seems to be in high relief above the hair and no ear.
    Just my humble opinion.
     
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