The bidders are ravenous

I would 100% agree with you regarding sellers and the tricks they use. But I look for listings like this because if you look at the seller's other items or previous sales there are no coins. They are all random items. So while the photos are crappy, they are crappy because the seller knows nothing about coins. Even the listing title is one that Ebay suggests for you. So there's a chance the seller didn't know how good a coin he really had. That being said, why would anyone pay 610!?!?!?

These are the listings I hate and try to stay away from:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/MORGAN-DOLL...425513?hash=item3f5a824169:g:hjQAAOSwZG9WkypI

Just post a normal picture and let the buyer judge. I swear these listings have shill bidders too. Then there's the ones where they do something with the lighting to make the cameo look like a modern ASE and hide all the bag marks. And people either bid stupid money on them or the shill bidders do hoping someone will bite.

Here's another one:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1883-CC-MORGAN-DEEPEST-B-W-CAMEO-I-HAVE-EVER-SEEN-BLINDING-24-INCH-MIRRORS-UDM-/391357535033?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&nma=true&si=Ov6zi5V2IW3ws4b%2FNzBAU%2F8D0WU%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

Now I know it's hard to capture DMPL, but he does a pretty good job with that Keno board thing. But just use a normal picture, it's like he used MS paint on the devices.

Edit: I've been accused of taking pictures that make my coins look worse, but I take them the same way every time. That way you can see the luster and every imperfection. It probably leaves some money on the table if I sell them, but the buyer will be pleasantly surprised rather than disappointed.

Double edit: How hard is it to take a picture in focus? All i have is an iphone and that's all you really need to take an accurate photo. Sometimes the fancy photos I see really hide imperfections also. I am wary of the "professional" photos. They always look better than the coins.

@SuperDave mentioned that scans can be valuable. I used to think they were useless, but after he mentioned it, I think they can be very useful. Like he said, ideally you'd want a high resolution scan AND a properly focused photo.

 

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There was no way I thought it would go that high!

 

Hey, he could have just lucked into the perfect tricky lighting and angle setup. Sure that's plausible but I would be leary about him nonetheless. And as for why it went so high is most likely because of ebay's return policy and 2 or more bidders who know how to exploit it if it's not a 66 or better

 

This is probably real conservative stand, but, for me, it isn't PL or DMPL unless a TPG says it is.

 

That's fine, but this was literally the first coin he sold. The rest of his sales were random auto parts, playstation games, and purses.

It's not really tricky lighting. It's natural indoor lighting.

But even with no direct lighting, I tried to make this 63 look good. But you can still see it doesn't really.



Edit: He is selling a book about how to make maximum profit or something, so maybe he's experimenting. Like I said, there was not enough information in the photo to determine its quality, I think you're right. People just go crazy thinking they can return it if it's not spectacular.

 

Don't forget, there are all kinds of people out there who don't think twice about laying a kilobuck with a Vegas sports book. Enough so the sports books stay in business and make money.

There are collectors with that mentality, and similar disposable income. This one might well have been somebody's idea of a lark; the worst possible outcome is you end up a couple decades short of breaking even and have to hold it for the estate if you don't feel like taking the loss. Still just parked a fair chunk of value.

 

I saw that at the heritage auction last week!

 

A completely reasonable one.

Adding "start to follow him" in no way overshadows or changes the fact that you made an ill informed assumption and essentially labeled this fellow a scam artist before even bothering to look into his selling history. What makes you think there's even a chance he'll start selling more when his searchable history consists of a whopping TWO coins (this and another GSA sold over a year ago)? All things considered, is it not more likely the guy simply isn't well versed in coin photography, or that this is really the first step in some master plan to screw over "most inexperienced" buyers?

Likewise. It's okay though... I understand that it's easier to fault me for calling BS than it is to admit that you may have overreacted and/or misjudged, especially since you have zero evidence to back up your position.

 

Man you read way too much into stuff books. You must have way too much time on your hands

 

I'd bet dollars to dandelions the coin in post #1 is probably a 63 at best. With the seller's lack of numismatic sales and the terrible pics, I would hit the back button. If you forced me to name a number, I'd say maybe $200, and that's accounting for the GSA premium.

 

I'm with the group that thinks she looks better than she really is...

In the words of the CW song: I went home at 2 with a 10 and woke up at 10 with a 2.

 

Some folks are in it for the action.

Sports betting, lottery, cars, cards, coins, etc etc etc.

Fun? Maybe. But not always money-smart.

 

The original coin looks like clean surfaces from the pictures. However, it is not a particularly detailed picture, and the surface is, as has been said, blurry. The grade could be anyplace--anywhere from a 63 to a 66 depending on how the coin really looks in hand. The bidding was certainly insane, as the bidders certainly could not see the coin in hand to determine whether or not the look of the photos were representative of the condition of the coin. If it is a 66, then that was a good price. If it is a 63-65 Morgan CC common date, then the price was moon money. Depends upon the accuracy of those photographs--I would not buy a coin with photos that are that vague and poorly focused and exposed. I don't think it was a deliberate attempt to deceive--just lousy, poor detail in the photos.

 

I agree. Coins are relatively hard to photograph. How many times have we seen people posting terrible photos in the "What's it worth?" forum, expecting us to figure out the value of their potential treasure. And those are people with an incentive to post good photos! This guy has sold all of 2 coins, so I'd more likely put it down to inexperience than anything.

 

Without it being graded, I wouldn't touch it at that price.

 

We can listen to all of this BS about "it might have been this..." or "it might have been that..." but since no one here is now the owner of the coin, we'll never know for sure.

Chris

 

Perhaps, but at least I do just that before opening my mouth, and if that means I have "too much time...", I'm guilty as charged. My sincerest apologies for thinking it ridiculous that another innocent seller is, again, dragged through the mud here all so that the kiddies can play their games.

The better man to admits a mistake rather than doubles down on it, but hey...the golden rule be damned.

 

Your jumping the gun books. I admit when I'm wrong all the time. It's how one grows. But in this case I don't feel I'm wrong yet. It's TBD upon more evidence in terms of future coin listings. I'm not going to go back and forth with you on this subject any longer though

 

I'm the one who is "jumping the gun"? Seriously? Is this and any other unfairly targeted seller guilty until declared innocent by Judge Cascade? Should the "evidence" that's right in front of our faces be ignored in favor of blind ignorance and paranoia? NOTHING about this seller's listings or history even remotely suggest he's likely to ever sell in numbers necessary for any reasonable individual to conclude that he is, in fact, using an imaging technique designed to hide flaws, or that he is intentionally trying to deceive potential buyers. He has listed/sold two... TWO coins in over a year's time; this is "evidence", sir.

If less than ideal photos in a single listing is all the "evidence" one needs to acceptably (and publicly) label someone a crook, god help this hobby.

 

OMG