E Bay question

Have a question. I have bought several items on ebay with good results. Have noticed that some sellers do not offer shipping insurance on some items. My question is why would this not be offered on an item as an option. Would this not give addition assurance that the item you purchased has been shipped. I mean all a seller would have to say is they shipped it and is not responsible for loss merchandise by the postal department.

Even when I see a seller with a 100% feedback , I have to ask why. I am probably way off on this and have very limited experience on ebay. comments would be appreciated. thanks

 

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bama:
The only reason to not offer insurance is because they have to wait on line at the post office.
Also, many will insure if you ask them if it is available.
I would ask on high priced items.

 

thats notthe only reason, alot of sellers include insurance in the price of shipping .. they do this so they dont have a battle if the buyer chooses not to get insurance and then something happens to the package ..

this way, botht he buyer and the seller are covered, and no un-neccesary negs result.

 

I have the insurance option on all my auctions, to me it only makes sense. Also I use pay pal shipping so the only line I have, is the wait with my Dial-up internet connection. I don't know why some buyers don't offer insurance.
On a side note I have noticed with some sellers, if you don't opt for insurance, you probably won't see you coins. They somehow dissapear in shipping at an alarming rate.

 

In the end, especially if you accept paypal as payment, it is the seller's responsibility to ensure (not "insure" mind you) that the item arrives. If the seller choses not to insure the shipment, they (the seller, not the buyer) need to be aware that they will lose money if anything happens otherwise.

Insurance protects the seller, not the buyer. Few selling on ebay seem to understand this.

Now, there are a couple of exceptions to this. One, if the item is not covered by PayPal's buyer protection (see auction, it will state if it is). Two, if no funds can be recovered from the seller, you can file an insurace claim and hope to recover funds. I can tell you from personal experience though that the postal insurance claim route is slow (months and months).

 

It's easy to print the labels at your house and purchase insurance... all in the same transaction. Easy. Foolproof. No post office. No misspelled addresses.

Some sellers may not be aware of that, so yes... hanging around at the Post Office is daunting.

I always insure anything I ship, and insist on it for anything I buy.

 

Well, either the buyer or the seller can submit the claim. That's one of the first boxes you have to check (where funds will be sent), but... The thing is, there's not one single way to pay, and not one single way you (the buyer) may be covered, thus there's not one single method that can be recommended that fits all transactions.

PayPal's "buyer protection" (if offered, see auction) only covers the buyer *if* there are funds that they can recover (far as I can tell). If they can't recover funds, I do not think they (PayPal) will credit your account, but I will say that I don't think I've run into that particular situation (as I try to only bid on auctions where "buyer's protection" is offered, which also translates to -buyers with solid feedback ratings and history).

You see auctions where the seller states, "I will not be responsible or liable if insurance isn't chosen" -but that simply isn't correct. I guess that was the point I was trying to make, and that the buyer doesn't always need to purchase insurance.

Every case is different, but here's one example: Some of you may recall that I recently received an empty package that should have contained a $1,000 note. I paid $18 for shipping and the seller included insurance with it (that was his choice). The auction was eligible for PayPal's buyer's protection. Long story short, I filed a claim with PayPal and (after a somewhat legthy process) they credited my account almost $2,000. Of course, they got the funds from the seller's account.

Now, before that went through, I filed a USPS insurance claim, as it was insured. I was under the mistaken impression that PayPal would have referred my claim to the USPS due to the insurance, but they didn't (as I said, they credited my account). So the seller should have filed the USPS claim, not me. If the USPS grants the claim, I will get a check (made out to me) and the seller is relying on me to be honest (he's lucky I am) to write him a check for the USPS insurance amount.

Note: I really don't know what's going on with this though. It's been over a month longer than they said I'd hear from them (they said mid-March), and they may ask that the seller resubmit the claim, etc. I really don't know. I can tell you it's like dropping the claim into a blackhole, unlike most insurance deals where you need to fax paperwork, and they contact you, request info, confirm this and that, etc.

As you can see, I (the buyer) have been more than covered. If I was dishonest, I could even make a couple grand from this. The seller is completely unprotected. Now, if the seller spent the money and PayPal was not able to recover funds, I *believe* I'd be up the creek SOL -and I'd be looking for that USPS check to pay my loss, so like I said, there's not one way this all could have ended. At the moment though, I'm very relieved.

 

It IS the sellers responsibility to get you the item you bought. By paying for insurance you are subsidizing the sellers insurance costs. If the seller doesn't purchase insurance then it is HIS loss.If you go thru Paypal or not; ALWAYS USE A CREDIT CARD. If Paypal doesn't give you a refund for lost or damaged goods, you can stop payment thru your credit card co. your real insurance is your CREDIT CARD.

 

True, if there is no modification of that responsibility in the actual contract.

However, a fundamental concept of the law of contracts in a common law jurisdiction (including the US, each state of the US except Louisiana, Canada, England, etc.) is that the contract between two parties is what they say it is, unless it violates a specific statute.

When a seller (at auction or otherwise) says "You pay for shipping, and I won't be responsible for delivery unless you insure the merchandise", and the buyer, by entering a bid or otherwise, says "It's a deal", then unless there is an applicable law saying "A seller's responsibility for delivery may not be waived" you have an "FOB Seller's place of business" contract.

Consumer laws sometimes do restrict the right of the parties to alter some implied contract conditions, but none of the dozen or so states whose consumer laws I am familiar with from my years as counsel for banks and finance companies involved in multi-state operations, prohibits the agreement to limit seller responsibility for delivery; and the Uniform Commercial Code and similar laws expressly authorize FOB contracts.

Another important factor to keep in mind any time you are dealing with a counterparty outside your immediate geographic area is the practical difficulty of enforcing any breach of contract by a distant party, which often (not always) will require you to resort to the courts where the other guy is, not where you are!

 

I forgot Roy is/was a lawyer Note that most of what I posted has more to do with PayPal type payments and their policies, and less to do with law or courts. There are always courts available to deal with issues, regardless of anything I've posted. That's beyond the scope of what I was posting about (going further in terms of getting ones money back, etc.)

To put it another way, yes a seller may state, "I won't be responsible for delivery unless you insure the merchandise" -but that doesn't mean they don't have to send the item once payment is made. Now, we assume the seller has sent the item (unless it was their intent to defraud the buyer), but I've dealt with sellers who send items uninsured, with no delivery tracking (confirmation), etc., and the item never arrived. In other words, they have absolutely no proof that they sent it. Without question, PayPal will attempt (if there are funds in the seller's account) to get the funds back from the seller, even if insurance was not purchased.

I am unsure as to whether PayPal will accept a stated non-insurance clause/agreement and deny a refund based on that or not. I have to think whether I've ever had that issue.