Faces on coins

I know that this is a deep subject, but maybe some folks are interested in it.

Human faces have been on coins since ancient times. Back then it was mostly a kings faces on what we now call the obverse -- to show their power and control.

Now, skip to modern times. At first the USA had allegorical female Liberty faces. And, us students of numismatics now use the recognition of those faces and other markers to determine authenticity or fakery.

Also, now, most do not seem to like the faces on the new Presidential Dollars. Me too. Why?

Even for our oldest presidents, we have images already in our minds about what they look like, from paintings, photos, video -- even more so in recent times with live coverage.

So, maybe, we do not like these new images because they do not look like what we have already seen so many times, eh?

 

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One of the biggest problems today is that it is extremely hard to create a true likeness when technological advances like photography were not available centuries ago. We have to rely on an artist painting an accurate image of someone.

Chris

 

Seems like most US collectors stick to coins with the image of Miss Liberty with the exception of maybe wheat cents, since the Lincoln series has run for so long. Many people also collect wheat cents since many are still available in circulation.

 

The face of a President on a coin is not changing. What is changing is the image of Lady Liberty, once majestic, beautiful and powerful. Now frail, afraid, skinny and unattractive. If the government can change the public's image of what our country stands for through coinage, then we have less freedoms and a loss of our liberties.

More and more things are appearing on coins than ever before. Events, groups, images of each state, attractions, causes, etc. are now commonplace on coins for circulation. They use to be confined to commemorative coins but no longer. By law the US Mint must show a profit. When you take $.05 cents of various metals, combine then and stamp any image desired, give it a domination, and call it a coin, they show a profit. It cost the taxpayers millions just to store Susan B. Anthony dollars in vaults. They were first issued in 1979 and we still have them in sealed mint bags. No one wants them. The size and weight are restrictive. But they can't be melted as it would show a loss and that's against the law.

Unfortunately, as a country, we no longer have the strong beliefs that our founding father's established and died for. Our coinage proves that as does the belief in being "politically correct" in everything.

 

What law is that?

 

Not sure of the exact law number as there are too many laws governing the minting of coins. The Presidential Dollars are still being made for circulation, as required by law. Thank you Congress. There is Congressional talk of creating a bill to stop making them for circulation as more than 1 billion coins (dollars) are being stored in vaults. The public doesn't want them. If this talk becomes a bill and signed by the president, then that law would still allow some to be made for collectors. Every coin made requires a bill passed by Congress and signed by the President.

What our government does is called seigniorage. The definition is:
seign·ior·age
noun: seigniorage; noun: seignorage

1. profit made by a government by issuing currency, especially the difference between the face value of coins and their production costs.

It's like a tax but you don't pay directly. You pay indirectly, like inflation.

 

Let's face it, (pun intended) the artist that create the faces on US Coins have an incredible opportunity, potentially the entire world population may view their designs.

 

Strange, I've always believed that the beliefs that the founding fathers had back in the day was stronger than ever today.

 

Huh?

The public LOVES dollar coins. I've yet to see an unhappy face when I leave them as tips or use them to pay my grocery bill.

It's "business" that "hates" the dollar coin because "business" would rather not pay the extra costs associated with transitioning to a dollar coin which would include shipping, handling, storage, and retraining the youth of today to actually recognize what a coin is and how to count back change since public schools no longer teach this stuff.

As long as there is a dollar bill to be ordered, the dollar coin will simply languish in Federal Reserve Vaults (i.e. not government vaults) with the Federal Reserve Bank picking up costs associated with the storage of the coins.

The "mistake" made by our 535 individual "Kings" is in believing that "business" will accept an alternative method of paying out change when the fact of the matter is that the Federal Reserve Note should have been discontinued when the dollar coin was issued. People AND "business" will ALWAYS choose the easiest route for accomplishing a goal. The business route is to NOT order dollar coins but continue with the FRN's. The peoples route is to simply accept what's given to them in change and as long as it can be spent, they're happy!

 

Where I live and work, no one and I mean no one likes nor wants Dollar coins. There are 8 different banks and not a single one of them will order the Dollar coins. Yes businesses don't like them but neither do the customers that support those businesses. If the public loves them I don't see it and why would 1 billion Dollar coins be stored in government vaults if the public loves them. I certainly don't want the weight of a dollar coin in my pocket.

 

That bill was passed years ago. They haven't made President dollars for circulation since 2012.

There is no law that REQUIRES the mint to make a profit. The closest is a law that requires the production of the commemorative coin programs to NOT cause a loss to the government. If they do then the mint gets to keep the surcharge money that was supposed to go to whatever organization that was earmarked to receive it. (Happened to the Girl Scouts. Sales were poor and the Mint would have wound up in the red, so they took the $10 per coin that was supposed to go to the Girl Scouts. and stayed in the black.) If any private firm did something like that, sold something with the claim that X amount would go to a specific charity and then keep the money, they would be charged with fraud.

 

Which coined image of Lady Liberty are you thinking of here?

Or is this some kind of crypto-political metaphor?

There are presently a bunch of Presidential dollars bagged and stored, not so much SBAs. Actually the vault supply of SBAs ran low enough in the late '90s that, although brass Sacajawea dollars were already planned and not far off, it was deemed necessary to mint new 1999 SBAs in the interim. There was (and is) demand for dollar coins, it's just that the availability of paper $1s (and inertia, and various misconceptions) keeps it to a trickle.

 

That is what I thought, this some sort of political message but unsure what it is based on. One loss I was thinking of with commemorative coins was the Columbian half that were intended for sale but many just got dumped in circulation. I am wondering about the Isabella quarters minted for the same Columbian Expo, why they are worth so much more. Perhaps not many were minted?

 

I think it's way overdue for those (language) in Washington to put MISTER Liberty on our coins.

 

I forgot to mention about the shield coins like the shield nickel or 2 cent coin and commemorates. These coins don't have Miss Liberty on them. Wasn't it Washington that didn't want to be on the money since that is what kings did? I have been reading about the Isabella quarter. That also didn't do well but many got melted except for the coins purchased at face value by the Board of Lady Managers.

 

It does seem usually that the obverse is a head, but, (read the books and articles: this is not always the case). As to who choses the obverses and reverses is always up to history.

 

Seems whomever was the chief engraver of the mint calls the shots but not always, like in the instance of the St. Gaudens $20 gold piece. There are several coins that don't have a head on the obverse like walkers, standing liberty quarters, seated liberty coins, shield nickels and 2 cent pieces, 3 cent silvers, and various commemorates. There are a lot of coins with a head, whether it is of Miss Liberty, a president, or some other historical figure.

 

Maxfli... It's time to wake up and smell the coffee.

This will never happen.

 

Or, what we "perceive" to be correct...imagine if they put JC's picture on a U.S. coin!

 

Or...Adam and Steve...why not have two faces on a coin (TIC comment )